Thank you scheme providers. You are destroying a once respected trade.

[Octopus]

i`m that close Murdoch...i really am....
and like i says...i doubt he`s got any public liability either....
carrying out works in/on other folk`s property without the necessary insurance to cover it if it all goes arse up....grrrrr..

Pm his details and I'll do the dirty if you want!!

 

[GLENNSPARK]

So the year is 1972. You are working for a large engineering company who have there own electrical department.
They take you on as an apprentice and you work along side time served qualified electricians, who are many years your senior.
You attend day release at college and cover a C&G 236 three year course in electrical intallations. At the end of that time you have covered a wealth of practical experience, mainly by men you respect, and know the trade profficiently.
You decide to attend the C certificate course two evenings a week for a further two years and recieve technicians status.
Later in life other courses come up 16th edition, 17th edition, and then theres the 2391.
As a JIB member you apply for and recieve the JIB gold card at approved status.
And then theres your schem providor saying your the qualifying officer.
Your responsibilities through the years have also resulted in a JIB platinum sight managers card.
40 years later, and you your asking yourself what was it all about ??
Because after all that your not a Part P electrician.
Just sharing where and what I am. And wondering even now what makes these guys qualified ???????????

a `part P` card makes em qualified.....well in the eyes of johnny public anyway...
but making someone feel qualified.....and them actually being qualified..are 2 different things bald....
its disturbing when the self esteem bandits are let loose isn`t it....

 

[Silly Sausage]

i`m that close Murdoch...i really am....
and like i says...i doubt he`s got any public liability either....
carrying out works in/on other folk`s property without the necessary insurance to cover it if it all goes arse up....grrrrr..

Just do it Glenn, don't let some other <word of choice> wind you up!!!

 

[44ALLAN]

It's like a game of cluedo this is....................whudunnit lol

Suspense is killing me...........:shocked3:

 

[Deleted member 9648]

So the year is 1972. You are working for a large engineering company who have there own electrical department.
They take you on as an apprentice and you work along side time served qualified electricians, who are many years your senior.
You attend day release at college and cover a C&G 236 three year course in electrical intallations. At the end of that time you have covered a wealth of practical experience, mainly by men you respect, and know the trade profficiently.
You decide to attend the C certificate course two evenings a week for a further two years and recieve technicians status.
Later in life other courses come up 16th edition, 17th edition, and then theres the 2391.
As a JIB member you apply for and recieve the JIB gold card at approved status.
And then theres your schem providor saying your the qualifying officer.
Your responsibilities through the years have also resulted in a JIB platinum sight managers card.
40 years later, and you your asking yourself what was it all about ??
Because after all that your not a Part P electrician.
Just sharing where and what I am. And wondering even now what makes these guys qualified ???????????

Pretty much sums it up......replace '72 with '79, apprenticeship with NIC contractor....'C' course in my own time.....15th-16th-17th....2391.....and technically I cant legally replace my own CU without coughing a wedge to a scam.

 

[SirusDvirus]

Think its found in any trade really..you'll get the competant and professional and you'll get the workday w**nkers who think they're worth the money it says on thier van..I'm relatively new to the trade myself and admit I'm still wet behind the ears or as my old boss says I've still got a hole in my A**e we all started somewhere, although I do disagree with the fastrack courses that are in place 13 weeks and you're a qualified sparks ? Wrong!! I took the correct route and 5 years later I'm still learning... Complacency and over-confidence in your ability is the rub...I may have my bit of paper but I know my limits

 

[baldsparkies]

Think its found in any trade really..you'll get the competant and professional and you'll get the workday w**nkers who think they're worth the money it says on thier van..I'm relatively new to the trade myself and admit I'm still wet behind the ears or as my old boss says I've still got a hole in my A**e we all started somewhere, although I do disagree with the fastrack courses that are in place 13 weeks and you're a qualified sparks ? Wrong!! I took the correct route and 5 years later I'm still learning... Complacency and over-confidence in your ability is the rub...I may have my bit of paper but I know my limits

Well said sir.
But sadly your talking from the mind set of a proper electrician. Knowing your own limits !!
Now in my book. Thats a competant person right there.
The man who knows what he DOESN'T know. Thats what makes you competant.
You say 5 years later and your still learning. I tell you now, 40 years later and I'm still learning.
But again we are talking about those who take pride in there trade.
I still feel the JIB card is probably the nearest thing to proving competance and qualifications.
It scares the hell out of me when I see the kind of idiots people are letting through there front doors.
That said less than a year ago we attended a data centre at two in the morning that had lost its servers supplies. The genny had not kicked in, and the UPS had run flat after 20 minutes. Some twit had fitted a 400A MCCB after the genny change over panel, when an identical OC unit was fitted further down stream.
The original had been correctly calibrated. New one had not ???
How the hell was the genny ever supposed to see the supply had been lost.
Again unskilled persons not thinking about what there doing. And believe me, the down time cost the company a LOT of money. And I mean A LOT.
So its not just domestic stuff is it lads !!

 

[oldtimer]

old....the person in question is claiming openly on a public forum that he is a scheme member....when he isn`t.....
and you think they wont do owt about it.....

Well that's different because they will jump all over him yep as I said morals and ethics mean nothing but even a scheme does not give anyone a free ride

 

[ackbarthestar]

That was an interesting Friday afternoon read.
There are some particularly good points such as companies using sub-contractors in the mid-eighties. I think that this is where it all began to go pear shaped in the industry - a sort of deregulation of the skilled workforce.
and what about the continuing blacklisting of certain trades persons ?

However....... When I applied to do an electrical apprenticeship, having come out of the electronics industry, back in those times (30 years ago) as a 'mature' person, I was laughed at and told there was nothing available, that still ****es me off. So it doesn't really surprise me that deregulation has happened , its sometimes feels like a battlefield........

 

[oldtimer]

Just been flicking through June's edition of Professional Electrician and 2 things struck me on page 5 Viewpont the editor is questioning if Part P is any longer valid as it has been trimmed and on page 79 NICEIC are advertising their online courses with 95% pass rate free for all springs to mind

 

[rapparee]

this is a proposed licence in the north of Ireland The proposed SparkSafe licence to practice initiative is for qualified electricians, electrical workers and apprentices in the construction industry.
Qualified assessors using agreed criterion will help determine a fair and appropriate licence type for each applicant based upon qualifications, skills and experience.
Three licence types are envisaged, these are Qualified Electrician, Restricted Electrical Worker and Apprentice Electrician. SparkSafe LTP | About SparkSafe

 

[oldtimer]

We could ask another question here where do the schemes get off by trying to make us justify ourselves to them plus there is no going back they have flooded the trade with quick trained people who on paper are qualified but are on here via their smart phone posting HELP!!!!!! the RCD or the CU or the Earthing threads.

As for Northern Ireland yet again someone is flying an idea so lets trial it in NI a bit like Thatcher when she said roll out the Poll Tax in Scotland and see how it goes and that was only because her civil servants were saying this just aint going to work.

 

[rapparee]

As for Northern Ireland yet again someone is flying an idea so lets trial it in NI a bit like Thatcher when she said roll out the Poll Tax in Scotland and see how it goes and that was only because her civil servants were saying this just aint going to work.

to be honest I think it is a good thing, all ni's sparks are apprentices passed by the electrical training trust, we would be the only people entitled to the licence's [unless your one of the old brigade with years of experience or a pre 1997 4 year apprenticeship from your local regional college]

 

[oldtimer]

to be honest I think it is a good thing, all ni's sparks are apprentices passed by the electrical training trust, we would be the only people entitled to the licence's [unless your one of the old brigade with years of experience or a pre 1997 4 year apprenticeship from your local regional college]

Yep its the similar in Scotland but I look at England with dismay and hope we never go the same way thing is in England the genie is out of the bottle

 

[rapparee]

Think its found in any trade really..you'll get the competant and professional and you'll get the workday w**nkers who think they're worth the money it says on thier van..I'm relatively new to the trade myself and admit I'm still wet behind the ears or as my old boss says I've still got a hole in my A**e we all started somewhere, although I do disagree with the fastrack courses that are in place 13 weeks and you're a qualified sparks ? Wrong!! I took the correct route and 5 years later I'm still learning... Complacency and over-confidence in your ability is the rub...I may have my bit of paper but I know my limits

i'm in the same boat I am 2 years out of my 4 year apprenticeship and I also have my 2391, and I still reckon I am nowhere near good enough to know it all, I come on to this forum not so much for advice but more of a nosey as to see how others would do things, but sometimes you realise it is a bit of the blind leading the blind

 

[Knobhead]

Yep its the similar in Scotland but I look at England with dismay and hope we never go the same way thing is in England the genie is out of the bottle

OT, I look at the entire electrical industry and despair.

Being retired it makes no odds to me now. I just get wound up about everything!




Later in the year I’ve got to have EICR done on my place. I feel sorry for the poor schmuck that gets it to do.

 

[Octopus]

OT, I look at the entire electrical industry and despair.

Being retired it makes no odds to me now. I just get wound up about everything!




Later in the year I’ve got to have EICR done on my place. I feel sorry for the poor schmuck that gets it to do.

Why don't you do it?

 

[Guest55]

Later in the year I’ve got to have EICR done on my place. I feel sorry for the poor schmuck that gets it to do.

i'll do it !

 

[UNG]

We could ask another question here where do the schemes get off by trying to make us justify ourselves to them plus there is no going back they have flooded the trade with quick trained people who on paper are qualified but are on here via their smart phone posting HELP!!!!!! the RCD or the CU or the Earthing threads.

As for Northern Ireland yet again someone is flying an idea so lets trial it in NI a bit like Thatcher when she said roll out the Poll Tax in Scotland and see how it goes and that was only because her civil servants were saying this just aint going to work.

If a licence scheme was brought in there would be many arguments as to where the level or levels for a graded system would be set this would upset some but lifting the standards and level of training back to somewhere sensible must be part of the object of such a licence if it was brought in

Labours part p is something akin to the tories poll tax ill thought out and not fit for purpose and it's about time it was put out to grass with all the schemes and these pathetic training companies

 

[SPARTYKUS]

Never go, theres too much face to loose & too much money being made. Here to stay I think.