Electrician Jobs External mains power inside house?

[David1128828]

Hi,
Just looking for a bit of advice, we live in a semi, and the mains power runs along our neighbours wall (about half way up the house) and then goes into our consumer unit which is in the kitchen.

We have just begun building a lean to extension, which effectively means that the mains power is running in an internal wall, with no external fuse etc. The electrician has fitted a metal casing over the mains power, but my question is whether this is the correct thing to do. He says he will give us all the necessary certificates and is fully accreditted, but we are not sure it seems right.

Thank you in advance,
David

 

[PEG]

Hi,where is the metering/main fuse? Also,what type of supply is it?

Your electricians certificates would most likely apply to parts of the installation,after the supply intake.

What reason, have you to believe,that he has acted incorrectly?

 

[David1128828]

Hi Peg,

Thanks for your reply.
Pre extension - if you imagine our house is two up two down - (downstairs there's a living room and kitchen) the mains power runs along the outside of the back wall, and then comes into the kitchen, where there is the meter/main fuse.

The extension is being built directly on to the back wall of the full width of the house - but the mains wire is not being moved - just being covered up with a thick metal casing - so is now on an internal wall of the house (behind plaster etc). The fuse/meter etc is in the same place (in the kitchen). There is no fuse on the outside of the new extension. Hopefully that makes sense!

I have no reason to believe he has acted incorrectly, he is well respected and comes recommended, but i wanted a second opinion on the matter. Any advice gratefully received.

Thank you in advance

David

 

[Ian1981]

I would imagine that if this cables is the DNO supply cable then it would need to be accessible in case of any problems with it and not concealed within someone’s property.
The DNO will have regulations regarding this I would imagine (ESQCR)

 

[westward10]

Wonder if it will be in a "safe" zone because if it is the DNO cable as Ian says I would not want to drill through it

 

[Spoon]

Hi Dave,

with a thick metal casing

This is to protect the cable.
If you want the cable moving them you could ring up your DNO supplier and get them to move it. This might cost quite a bit.
Your electrician can't move this cable himself. All cables before the meter are the responsibility of the DNO supplier.

 

[Pete999]

Hi,
Just looking for a bit of advice, we live in a semi, and the mains power runs along our neighbours wall (about half way up the house) and then goes into our consumer unit which is in the kitchen.

We have just begun building a lean to extension, which effectively means that the mains power is running in an internal wall, with no external fuse etc. The electrician has fitted a metal casing over the mains power, but my question is whether this is the correct thing to do. He says he will give us all the necessary certificates and is fully accreditted, but we are not sure it seems right.

Thank you in advance,
David

David, just got up and read this post, forgive me if I have it wrong, but what sort of cable is it you are talking about, again I may be wrong but if this cable runs into your consumers unit, then I would suggest that it may not be a main cable but a supply to something else, looking forward to the answers.

 

[Spoon]

Just re-read this @Pete999 and I see what you mean.

In the OP's first post he says "and then goes into our consumer unit which is in the kitchen."
In the OP's second post he says "the mains power runs along the outside of the back wall, and then comes into the kitchen, where there is the meter/main fuse."

 

[Pete999]

Just re-read this @Pete999 and I see what you mean.

In the OP's first post he says "and then goes into our consumer unit which is in the kitchen."
In the OP's second post he says "the mains power runs along the outside of the back wall, and then comes into the kitchen, where there is the meter/main fuse."

OP can you post some pictures of the cable etc?

 

[Octopus]

Interesting one this .............. inside the property now, is there ANY obvious indication that the cable is there?

Could the OP post a picture?

 

[Midwest]

Seen quite a few supplies (especially TT) routed through a property by the DNO, sometimes not so obvious a route; but that should be done or arranged by the DNO. Bit late now that it's covered in capping & plaster, isn't it?

 

[David1128828]

Thanks everyone.
Will post a pic in a mo -

I believe it to be a mains cable - it goes from the overhead power line accross the street, and then goes along the wall of our neighbours (the other half of the semi) and into our house.

The casing is definately there to stop you from drilling into it- it isnt fused, so as far as i am aware you would be drilling directly into the mains...

My question really is whether it is safe or correct to do this. The positioning of the cable is such that you would never really want to drill into that area of the wall, and the casing is angled so that any drill bit would be diverted to either side of the cable.

It is not yet in plaster, just being cased, so not too late (but nearly).

The other alternative is to get the house rewired, and get the Electric Supplier/owner of the cable (in this case Scotish Power) fitting a fuse on the outside of the house, and then getting the electrician to move the consumer unit/meter etc to the internal wall of the extension.

But the electrician said that we could do this (case the cable) and save 2-3K.

 

[Pete999]

Thanks everyone.
Will post a pic in a mo -

I believe it to be a mains cable - it goes from the overhead power line accross the street, and then goes along the wall of our neighbours (the other half of the semi) and into our house.

The casing is definately there to stop you from drilling into it- it isnt fused, so as far as i am aware you would be drilling directly into the mains...

My question really is whether it is safe or correct to do this. The positioning of the cable is such that you would never really want to drill into that area of the wall, and the casing is angled so that any drill bit would be diverted to either side of the cable.

It is not yet in plaster, just being cased, so not too late (but nearly).

The other alternative is to get the house rewired, and get the Electric Supplier/owner of the cable (in this case Scotish Power) fitting a fuse on the outside of the house, and then getting the electrician to move the consumer unit/meter etc to the internal wall of the extension.

But the electrician said that we could do this (case the cable) and save 2-3K.

Obviously not a very knowledgeable Electrician imo

 

[David1128828]

Here is a photo of the outside of the house mid build.

 

[David1128828]

Hi Pete,
So what would you recommend?

Thanks
David

 

[Spoon]

Obviously not a very knowledgeable Electrician imo

What part mate?
What do you see wrong with what the electrician has done?

 

[Pete999]

Hi Pete,
So what would you recommend?

Thanks
David

Where you have said CU fuse is that where the meter is?it seems odd to me if that is the case, either way you need to contact the DNO if this is the cable feeding your house to hear their recommendations, don't mean to be a hindsight freak, but did your builder not mention this problem? daft question really all he is interested in is the building, every thing else is your problem. I would, contact DNO as a matter of urgency before anymore building work is done, sorry I can't offer any more advice.
What do you intend to do with the wall the cable is on, with regards to a covering medium?

 

[David1128828]

Hi Pete,
It's a 30's house, and all the houses on this stretch are the same - i.e. the power line goes directly into houses (with fuse on the inside of the house) - this was like this when we bought it, and the neighbours all have the same system, so i am not worried about that. The wiring in that photo is as we bought the house.

We knew about the problem, had scottish power out, and was going to move everything until the electrician said you could do it this way instead. Having a last minute panic to confirm it is OK.

 

[Pete999]

What part mate?
What do you see wrong with what the electrician has done?

Well I would have thought that he should have realised the problem, and mentioned it straight away, perhaps "not very knowledgeable" is being a bit of a harsh comment, still think it should have been noticed and dealt with before any building work, think also the planning people should have noted it as well. My opinion is that this should have been dealt with at the onset of the works. That's all I can say. so I'll sign off now, as I can see this thread becoming a mud slinging exercise.

 

[David1128828]

Thanks for your help Pete.

 

[Pete999]

Thanks for your help Pete.

Your Welcome, Hope you can sort things out.

 

[Spoon]

That's all I can say. so I'll sign off now, as I can see this thread becoming a mud slinging exercise.

No mud slinging from my direction mate.

 

[David1128828]

So what you recon we should do - rewire the house, or go with our electrician.

 

[Spoon]

Have you any pics of the wiring inside your house. All the way to the Meter.

 

[David1128828]

not at the moment - as at work...that last photo happened to be on my phone.

 

[Midwest]

Hi Pete,
It's a 30's house, and all the houses on this stretch are the same - i.e. the power line goes directly into houses (with fuse on the inside of the house) - this was like this when we bought it, and the neighbours all have the same system, so i am not worried about that. The wiring in that photo is as we bought the house.

We knew about the problem, had scottish power out, and was going to move everything until the electrician said you could do it this way instead. Having a last minute panic to confirm it is OK.

I've seen DNO route their supply cable through house before now. Did Scottish Power provide you with a price for re-routing their supply cable?

 

[David1128828]

No- they said they'd put a fuse on the outside of the house. At the time we didn't want any wiring on the wall (as we were going to leave the brick exposed)...

 

[Midwest]

No- they said they'd put a fuse on the outside of the house. At the time we didn't want any wiring on the wall (as we were going to leave the brick exposed)...

I don't quite understand 'fuse on the outside of the house'?

 

[Midwest]

Guessing your supply is TT, overhead supply from pole (yours & neighbours), your supply set up should look something like this;

The cable going through your extension, is represented in the above diagram, by the piece of black cable. The rest of the above diagram, should be inside your existing property.

If your supply is a different one (not TT), the same set up exists, supply cable, main fuse, tails to meter, meter, meter tails to consumer unit.

 

[Midwest]

I don't quite understand 'fuse on the outside of the house'?

Were they going to install something like this, on the outside of your property?

 

[David1128828]

Hi Midwest,
You assume right on both counts.

 

[Midwest]

Hi Midwest,
You assume right on both counts.

How much did they quote, Scottish Power?

 

[David1128828]

about £600

 

[David1128828]

And then electrian another 2.5k (but that was an estimate)

 

[Midwest]

If you did go with SP relocating their cable & main fuse to a new meter cabinet, the meter would normally get relocated there too. You would then have to run a supply from the meter cabinet to your consumer unit, typically done with steel wired armoured cable (swa).

Is the 2.5k price for this new supply cable, its represented by the blue & brown cables in the diagram from meter to consumer unit?

 

[David1128828]

Yes, thats what they said - the cable/main fuse would be relocated there.

So you are saying that an armed cable wire can be fitted from the new meter cabinet on the side wall directly to the existing consumer unit (effectifely replacing the external mains wire with a fused armoured cable)?

The 2.5k price is for rewiring the internal wires from (what would be) the old consumer unit in the kitchen to the new consumer unit on the side wall of the extension. I am not sure if SP or the electrician would move the blue wire - assume it would be the electrician.

 

[Midwest]

Personally if it was my property, I would have the DNO supply relocated to a meter box, and run new customer supply swa cable to the consumer unit.

I see, the 2.5k is for effectively relocating consumer unit (CU), extending existing final circuits to new CU position, and running new swa cable from meter box to new CU position, and obviously new CU?

 

[David1128828]

OK, Thank you - that is the advice i was looking for...

You are correct about what the 2.5k is for... But i imagine it would be much cheaper if we were just replacing the mains wire with a cable...

Thank you again, i'd owe you a beer or three!

 

[Midwest]

The blue (& brown!) wire is the responsibility of the property owner (meter to CU).

Difficult to say without looking at your property, but I would suggest 2.5k to move CU & new swa cable is a bit high, don't know what other members think?

Perhaps get some more quotes.

Are SP going to convert your TT supply to PME, as part of that £600? It might not be possible, if you & your neighbours is fed from the same supply, unless your neighbour has it done as well

 

[David1128828]

Not sure about the TT to the PME question... I just know they were going to put the fuse and meter where i mentioned.

Definitely will get more quotes. Thanks.

 

[PEG]

To be honest,it sounds like your spark,has done the best he can,being at the stage you are at.
Obviously,with hindsight,time,and a varying budget,the supply could have been moved - but the DNO can choose the cost,time scale and method,and any of them could cause discourse.

There are plenty of TT supplies,old and newer,arriving at one end/side,of a property,and winding their way through,with varying degrees or protection and forethought.

I have seen some older supplies,which in their day,would have been an addition to an existing building,post town gas and oil lanterns,where later on,the application of a new novelty product,such as internal plastering to a wall not,in a "best" room,has entombed the cable.

On occasion,these are discovered by DPC installers or shelf fitters,with alarming consequences.

Not that many seem to bother,these days,but i would set your electrician,up a notch,if he left some drawings/pictures,maybe laminated,to be zip tied to the meter,in a document tube.

These could be no more than a description of route,protection added,etc.

....or one could choose to wait for the day an extraction fan or soil pipe is required,and the unwitting core driller has a story for his mates...or not

 

[Midwest]

Nah just get it moved.

 

[Devonchris]

I came across a similar situation many years ago. Single storey extension with flat roof to provide nice veranda out from bedroom. Bottom of window cut away and French door fitted. DNO supply (2 single conductors 2 inch apart) was now running across the doorway about 9 inch from bottom. I don't know if they were going to have it moved or were happy to step over it to get in and out. But the extension seemed to have been there awhile.

Then one morning about 3 a.m. fire brigade turn up to deal with serious fire in bedroom. Glass in said door has gone and flames are pouring out. One firefighter with hose fights flames back and steps through door and into cable, which by now has no insulation left.

Big flash and bang but fortunately no shock felt. After a few seconds when sight and sound recovered there was no ill effects. Lucky escape. Both conductors were now hanging loose.

Could never understand the logic of it myself. This was Yorkshire. Who goes to the expense of a veranda when the most you can expect is 2 weeks sitting out weather a year.

 

[Sparkingmad]

Hi I would personally go with new meter box on outside DNO cable taken into it, with a new Steel Wired Armoured cable taken from that box into your existing fuse board location. Is the flooring in new lean too block and beam? As it’s a TT system and that new cable will be your distribution cable I believe you have to afford rcd protection on it even though it is SWA. You are allowed up to 1A distribution instead of 30mA for final circuits on a TT. So I strongly advise having a 100mA or 300mA Time delayed RCD fitted in the supply meter box to protect the swa cable along it route into your house.

 

[stevels4]

You may have been wise to have the service supply rerouted and an external flush mount meter box fitted, relocated the meter and then reconnected to your existing DB with new 25mm tails.
You will now have a service cable passing internally within the extension and I note from the picture there appears to be a joint near the end of the run.
This cable will need sufficient containment for protection bearing in mind the pole fuse rating could be around 800A.