In defence of the short course trainee

[GLENNSPARK]

better than shooting skyward in flames though flukey eh?...lol.....

 

[alarm man]

Great post Richy333 I've been using this forum for years now and have been so impressed with the conduct and banter of the group members but in the last few months noticed the change of attitude in reply posts. I can understand you may feel the 5 week wonders are getting in to easy and maybe getting experience from the forum, but the ones that make a career out of deserve it and rest that don't will have wasted money but had a go. I'm experienced and sometimes I feel intimidated to post due to the reply's I read to others.. But I say to say thanks to the regular posted like Lenny, engineer 54, malcomsanford, telextrics, dec 56 and many others you have helped many people with your answers read from a distance... Forget the politics its forum to help people.

granted forums are just like a site/work place,people discuss people argue,but the thing with forums people pop up 2 years later and say something out of the blue,ive always been suspect of those posters rather than regular posters..

 

[ian.settle1]

How do you make it 10 tests? I'd do 7.

Test between phases (3 tests), phases to neutral (3 tests), phases to earth (3 tests) and the last is neutral to earth (1 Test) hence 10 tests

 

[craig newby]

alarmman... why?

 

[alarm man]

alarmman... why?

why what...ask yourself

 

[craig newby]

its ok you just answered it for me.

 

[mechelec]

I've no doubt that from your attitude i.e you don't think you know it all & realise that even after doing a Domestic installer course you really won't be competent to do it on your own. Then you will get sensible answers even if you think the questions are silly, as has been said previously what rankles with most of us is the DI's that come on here telling us how fully qualified they are & how much they know & then ask questions the equivalent of how do i turn a light on. Anyway welcome to the Forum & ask away.

You have hit the nail on the head bang on. I would try to help If I could (i am wrong sometimes) but as you say someone starts a basic question by saying how qualified they are and it will make some less inclined to help, sorry

 

[alarm man]

its ok you just answered it for me.

im an opinionated ******* i admit,whats your excuse son...

 

[craig newby]

Its ok I'll go back cage. I was a bit taken back by your reply that's all, but now I think about it you are right to mention the length between post. Not to worry it just was a interesting subject thanks for the input.

 

[DNS1]

I think this is a very good topic started by Downtoearth and agree with everything they have said.

I am currently thinking of a similar course.. one evening a week for around 6 months, plus lots of study/practice in my own time I expect. I already work full time and look after my son by myself on my days off so this is my only option.

I do feel quite hesitant to ask questions sometimes on a electrical forum as often you get some remarks that just make you feel silly and stupid for asking. I have recently joined and have so far had a good experience of this site and hope that when I do start asking more questions I will not be shot down in flames for being 'dangerous'. I would simply be asking so as to further my knowledge and would have no intention of actually doing anything electrical until I was 100% certain it was safe.

I am very pleased and quite excited that such courses are available and fully intend to undertake one. I am then legally allowed to undertake work as a domestic installer but will still not do anything until I believe I am competent to do so.

If, or rather when (actually I already have) I do start asking silly questions please do as 'downtoearth' asks and give me a sensible reply that will point out my errors and encourage me to learn.

Thanks all.

You sound like me mate.

There will always be a bit of banter and mickey taking on here, as well as people moaning about the quick course installers, but if you ask the sensible questions you're pretty much assured of a straight and honest answer.

There's a big difference between asking for help with a calculation or interpreting a reg and saying "I'm installing a shower for someone, what size cable should I use?"

Who are you planning on training with? If it's evening classes it sounds like a local college or similar so you're likely on the right track. As everyone has been saying, avoid the "£8k to be a fully qualified electrician" centres like the plague...

Best of luck!

 

[malcolmsanford]

I think a lot of this also is a generation thing, when it comes down perhaps a few of us seemingly look to be aggressive or un-helpful, when in reality it isn't.

Yesterday a member who is very respected posted a question and it was so off the wall, he himself came back on and admitted after reading it, it made little sense, and a few of the lads gave him the leg pull about it, but he took it as it was meant to be.

The forum as really taken over from the tea hut in many respects, you discuss things, ask questions, and if you ask a silly one you tend to get lumps shot off you, but in most cases everyone is there to help. Of course you will get, even in the tea hut someone that takes the banter to far, or is even an a hole, but like tea huts, they are soon put in their place and generally ignored.

I hope anyone reading our forum, and after all it is our forum, do not shirk back from asking anything, you may get your legged pulled by a few of us, but I can guarantee from the majority of us you will get a straight and positive answer, even if it isn't what you hoped for.

 

[DNS1]

Good comparison, but the obvious difference is that if you say something stupid to a couple of guys in the tea hut, you've got a couple of guys taking the mickey, whereas on here you've got every member and his dog seeing what you've said!

Despite all the leg pulling on here, I'm sometimes amazed at how patient the "serious" members are when it comes to stupid questions by the likes of trainees like me, pro sparks having a blonde moment and people who only sign up cos "the kitchen lights have gone mate, when i stuck a neon screwdriver in the hole nothing happened".

 

[Breaker]

It wasn't a 5 week course for me. It was two years of studying, 5 practicals and exam visits, lots of unpaid work experience. As well as a serious investment of a lot of money.

It's easy to dismiss it as just 5 weeks. Since then I have met loads of spark's that have done apprenticeships. Most of them admit that they never learnt anything because they were more interested in women when they were apprentices and failed almost every exam they took.

And where am I now? Applying for an £8 an hour job wiring modular toilets for people to urinate in. Yeah, so get the idea of £30K a year out of your heads because you have to still start at the very bottom.

 

[Engineer54]

As far as i'm concerned, as far as the title of this thread goes, ...There is no defence for electrical trainee's or the new 17 day whizz kidz, End Of!!

 

[Breaker]

No such thing as a 5 week wonder. He only exists in your head.

If anyone has told you that they did a five week course and walked into a job as a sparky then they are bull****ting you.

Don't be so gullible.

 

[ipf]

No such thing as a 5 week wonder. He only exists in your head.

If only......................

I see it's nearly 2 years since this particular old chestnut last fell from the tree. Things will never change....for the better, that is.

 

[Engineer54]

No such thing as a 5 week wonder. He only exists in your head.

If anyone has told you that they did a five week course and walked into a job as a sparky then they are bull****ting you.

Don't be so gullible.

I think you're the gullible one!! They don't get employed by companies, they start their own one man band companies, and with the shameful blessing of all the scheme providers!!


Jesus,...do you walk around with your eyes closed and with ear plugs permanently stuck in your ears or what?? lol!!

 

[Breaker]

This reminds me of the old boy's complaining when I started my first job over 30 years ago. Complaining that it aint done properly anymore and all the youngsters aint any good.

Same old, same old.

Anyone who starts out as a one man band even after an apprenticeship is an idiot, I wouldn't worry about it. Just think of the money you will make putting their work right.

But in the meantime don't tar them all with the same brush. After all a lot of them come from technological backgrounds anyway. Some of them are taking a step down to be an electrician.

 

[MDJ]

. Some of them are taking a step down to be an electrician.

Name 2 Then?

 

[Breaker]

Joe Bloggs and Fred Smith..........