Level of qualification needed to obtain licence?

[Engineer54]

There are a lot good sparks out there that wouldn't pass the 2391 2394 2395 simply because the way cg interpret the written exam you almost need a photographic memory,havin said that you may have all the knowledge and experience in the world so is this fair?

Well if they are fully qualified electricians, they have done it once to gain their C&G, so why can't they not do it again?? It's not exactly a long drawn out course is it??.

 

[m top]

Well if they are fully qualified electricians, they have done it once to gain their C&G, so why can't they not do it again?? It's not exactly a long drawn out course is it??.

Fair point so why is there only a 30% pass rate many that take this exam are experienced sparks ??

 

[cmac70]

Need find the time and cash to get to do my 2395 written re-sit other things end up eating the cash. Not sure how I go about doing nvq 3 as I work for what ever agencies I can as I am building my own customer base up. So really speaking I would say you need to have done at 3 years college time to be classed as a spark and go on a register.☺

 

[Hawkmoon]

Fair point so why is there only a 30% pass rate many that take this exam are experienced sparks ??

But are they experienced in inspection/testing?
The exam is closed book so as I said previously, you need to study

 

[m top]

But are they experienced in inspection/testing?
The exam is closed book so as I said previously, you need to study

Couldn't agree more all I am trying to say is I believe many sparks take this exam and come unstuck because of the way cg interpret the questions some people just can't get there heads round it,I am not going to go of thread but someone posted earlier that Electrical Trainee pass this because the knowledge is fresh from there study's,the point I'm trying to make is good sparks fail this simply because of this not that they can't test and inspect

 

[Hawkmoon]

Couldn't agree more all I am trying to say is I believe many sparks take this exam and come unstuck because of the way cg interpret the questions some people just can't get there heads round it,I am not going to go of thread but someone posted earlier that Electrical Trainee pass this because the knowledge is fresh from there study's,the point I'm trying to make is good sparks fail this simply because of this not that they can't test and inspect

I agree there are occasionally questions that may be ambiguous but if your success is dashed by one iffy question on the paper then IMO you either didn't pay attention during the course or didn't prepare (or both).
Where you talk about knowledge being fresh after study (Electrical Trainee), this applies to the 2391 4/5 courses also - you do the course then the exam!

 

[Engineer54]

Fair point so why is there only a 30% pass rate many that take this exam are experienced sparks ??

That was for the C&G 2391, and the pass rate never dropped to just 30%. Isn't that one of the daft reasons they came up with for splitting the 2391?? To make it easier, not so much to remember in one go, or was that more of an excuse to squeeze more money out of the qualification. One more thing to remember, is that when any exam becomes ''easy to pass'', that exam becomes a pointless and meaningless benchmark... A bit like having an open book Lv 3 exam defining electrical competence as we have at the moment!! Well according to the training centres and scam providers anyway!!!

Remember, every qualification exam ever compiled is going to be hard for those that don't know the answers. The very reason you need to train and more importantly STUDY, so that when you do sit the Exam, you do know the answers.

 

[Guest55]

a 1 size fits all minimum licencing criteria will never work in an industry as diverse as electrical.

to work in domestic do you need all sparks to be at jib approved level ? course not , its mostly wiring by numbers anyway.

and would it be suitable for a short course trained installer to be fitting 3 phase db's in a commercial project unsupervised ? course not , you'd want someone with a higher level of experience.

theres alot to be said for allowing each part of the industry to decide its own craft requirements rather than blanket legislation.

we need to look at the big picture rather than trying to protect our own vested interests as meddling with qualification requirements nearly always creates a negative impact on the economy........

and we're all here to get paid right ?
;-)

 

[KAS1]

a 1 size fits all minimum licencing criteria will never work in an industry as diverse as electrical.

to work in domestic do you need all sparks to be at jib approved level ? course not , its mostly wiring by numbers anyway.

would it be suitable for a short course trained installer to be fitting 3 phase db's in a commercial project unsupervised ? course not , you'd want someone with a higher level of experience.

theres alot to be said for allowing each part of the industry to decide its own craft requirements rather than blanket legislation.

we need to look at the big picture rather than trying to protect our own vested interests as meddling with qualification requirements nearly always creates a negative impact on the economy........

and we're here to get paid right ?
;-)

That's very well put, however IMO it all goes back to proper training as in my JIB apprenticeship most aspects of electrical installation where covered from industrial/commercial to a bit of domestic etc and then after coming out of "your time" that's when the real learning began "working on your own" so when JIB graded operatives don't seem to be excepted as capable of doing domestic it amazes me as you say "its mostly wiring by numbers anyway" so perhaps it's time the JIB card was minimum standard for these so called "Domestic installers"

 

[D Skelton]

to work in domestic do you need all sparks to be at jib approved level ? course not , its mostly wiring by numbers anyway.

I don't think it should be. It never used to be wiring by numbers until we allowed it to become so with the birth of fast track training centers and domestic installation guides.

The way I see it, if you're going to install a circuit you need to know why you are doing it, why you are installing a specific size and type of cable, why your Zs needs to be below a certain level, what voltage drop is, what size cpc you need, the effects of electromagnetism, types of protective measure etc.... I could go on and on.

The fact is, commercial and industrial wiring could just as easily become wiring by numbers if we let it, but does that make for a better standard of installer? No. Because the lack of underpinning knowledge, that core understanding of electrical science and principles is no longer there.

It could even be argued that your average one man band domestic installer needs to be more knowledgable than your average jobbing commercial spark who does nothing but sling in SWA on ladder and pull singles through trunking day in day out. I won't make that argument, but it's there!