Photocell And Timeclock For External Lights?

[Kev2632]

Ive been asked how about a job which involves outsides lights, via a timeclock and Photocell.

The thing they are wanting to have is to have the ability too use the timeclock if they want too, then also to manual overide the timeclock and just use the Photocell.?

Now all this is to go through a contactor for lights,

Ive seen Timeclocks where there is a little switch on the front which you can override the timeclocks..?

How would you go about wiring this set up to work like this???

thanks

 

[feebs73]

Yes, this is quite common, i have done this many times, take the switch live and nutral from the time clock to a double pole isolation point i.e switch, then from the switch to the box with the contactor in it conect the nutral to a2, take a 3 core cable (from contactor box) connect switch live (from isolation point) with live of the 3 core in connector block nutral of 3 core in a2 along with the other nutral, than take switch live and nutral to photocell, live in Li, nutral to N and return live in Lo, the live from Lo then goes to a1 on you contactor, than place you light feeds in to contactor.

Hope that helps
Feebs73

 

[Kev2632]

Yes, this is quite common, i have done this many times, take the switch live and nutral from the time clock to a double pole isolation point i.e switch, then from the switch to the box with the contactor in it conect the nutral to a2, take a 3 core cable (from contactor box) connect switch live (from isolation point) with live of the 3 core in connector block nutral of 3 core in a2 along with the other nutral, than take switch live and nutral to photocell, live in Li, nutral to N and return live in Lo, the live from Lo then goes to a1 on you contactor, than place you light feeds in to contactor.

Hope that helps

Yea im kind of understand what your meaning?

How does this set up allow the timeclock also to switch on the lights?

Could you do up a wee sketch if possible??

Thanks.

 

[RogertheBodger]

Hi Kev.
To make the circuit you have described work,You would need to wire both these devices in series with your contactor coil circuit, when you override the time switch, it would put a constant supply on to the photocell to illuminate your lights during the hours of darkness.

When your time switch is not in override, it would switch the lighting circuit on or off at the set times. as long as it's dark of course.

 

[Kev2632]

Hi Kev.
To make the circuit you have described work,You would need to wire both these devices in series with your contactor coil circuit, when you override the time switch, it would put a constant supply on to the photocell to illuminate your lights during the hours of darkness.

When your time switch is not in override, it would switch the lighting circuit on or off at the set times. as long as it's dark of course.

Yea so the Photocell will only work when the timeclock allows it too? is that correct?

 

[RogertheBodger]

No, if the Time switch is in the ON position (override) the photocell will be on until it gets light or the time switch is restored to AUTO.

Yes, on second thoughts the photocell will only work when the time switch gives it a supply.

 

[feebs73]

as soon as you involve a photo cell it becomes quite hard i have never been asked to over ride, as people like the way it works, why would you want the lights on in day light?

 

[Kev2632]

No, if the Time switch is in the ON position (override) the photocell will be on until it gets light or the time switch is restored to AUTO.

ahh right yea, so when the timeswitch is set back to auto, it will then keep the photocell live and switch the lights off when it gets lighter yea?

 

[RogertheBodger]

ahh right yea, so when the timeswitch is set back to auto, it will then keep the photocell live and switch the lights off when it gets lighter yea?

Sorry, I think I've confused you, I have edited post 6.

Let's put it this way, the time switch controls the photocell, the time switch can be set to AUTO or ON, In either case the Photocell will only operate when it's dark.

 

[infinity]

You need a 3 way switch, perm on, perm off and auto (time clock) fit contactor and time clock next to 3 way switch ( MK do a grid type)
that way auto- all operates through time clock, perm on- lights on at any time and perm off- lights off at all times! works well and is simple!you wire the lights, and photocell from the switch point!!

 

[Kev2632]

can the timeclock go in parallel with the photocell? will the backfeed affect the photocell??

 

[Knobhead]

Kev2632, this is simplicity it’s self.
View attachment 10586
I’ve shown this using an MK timer, a bit of jigging about it could be any timer unit you like.
This gives override permanent ON, override permanent OFF, timed or sensor ON. It only needs a bog standard two way, two gang switch

 

[Knobhead]

And a bit of common sense.
Any other permutations of the switching arrangement please write on a post card and send to No.16 NG18 5HH

 

[Kev2632]

And a bit of common sense!

would the Photocell or timeclock be affected by the backfeed of one n another??

 

[Engineer54]

And a bit of common sense.
Any other permutations of the switching arrangement please write on a post card and sent to No.16 NG18 5HH

Oh Dear, ....Commonsense i hear, died a fair while ago!! lol!!!

 

[Knobhead]

Not with most units. All I can say is check first, if you then don't regret later.

 

[Knobhead]

E54, you can be evil at times. But that’s why I hold you in such high esteem.

For others look for the “obituary to Common Sense”.

 

[i=p/u]

went to job on tuesday, load of outside lights working off sensor, and hand/auto switching, everytime tripped breaker when turned it on.

so foloowed the cables and they split underneath the building, so split the lights up dissconnected the line conductor still tripped, then started taking covers off the lights fittings(loads of them) and could smell fishy smell and there it was a ballast burned out.. seemed to take ages to find 2hours...

anyone anytips of the trade in improving my fault finding skills

 

[i=p/u]

and yes somone had added extra circuits into outoing of contactor but didnt know where neutrals was going.... was head frying for bit

 

[Knobhead]

i=p/u, I wish I could give a single definitive answer. BUT I can’t, END OF!

This is where tracking skills come in, luck plays a major hand.

From basics:
Split the circuit at some point that you think could be a mid-point (pound to a pinch of s**t it isn’t). restore power does it hold? YES then the faults somewhere in the bits you’ve disconnected, if NO it’s in the bits you haven’t. So to continue……..

i=p/u, get out your compass and payer mat, kneel down and pray. In all honesty I could not direct someone to a fault over the internet in lighting or for that matter a FRC.

You’re following an electrician that at the time was doing things correct, or Joe’s granddad from the corner pub that was even more Iffy than his offspring. You have to get in to his mindset. Where would he run a cable? Forget “zones” if the quickest way was at 45° then that’s the way it went. (GOD help you if you’ve come across some of my mates (animals)).

The bottom line is, I, and I don’t think any one else can help other than to say keep splitting down until you’ve struck gold (s**t)

Deus exsisto vobis