Why bother getting a gold card when they're giving away black ones.

[Joshua]

I think I've given up on our industry now.
More dumbing down from the JIB.

 

[Risteard]

I'm not entirely sure what your point is.

Black JIB cards (which were previously platinum cards) have existed for quite some time. These do not replace gold cards and do not permit the holder to take out a screwdriver on site.

 

[Gavin John Hyde]

they already in effect give the gold cards away, if you are the QS for a NICEIC approved contractor and have been for 3 years then you can get a gold card for around £50... no NVQ or AM2 required!

 

[MJPD29]

Wouldn't bother with one, never had one and never been asked for one just more money wasted

 

[Risteard]

they already in effect give the gold cards away, if you are the QS for a NICEIC approved contractor and have been for 3 years then you can get a gold card for around £50... no NVQ or AM2 required!

Those cards won't bear the JIB logo though.

 

[Joshua]

I'm not entirely sure what your point is.

Black JIB cards (which were previously platinum cards) have existed for quite some time. These do not replace gold cards and do not permit the holder to take out a screwdriver on site.

I'm not saying they're replacing gold cards

I'm saying that how can someone manage electricians if they've never been one? My mum could go and do a SSSTS course and become an Electrical site manager in 5 days. If you have been on a site recently you'll see you don't need a gold card to be let loose.

 

[Risteard]

I'm not saying they're replacing gold cards

I'm saying that how can someone manage electricians if they've never been one? My mum could go and do a SSSTS course and become an Electrical site manager in 5 days. If you have been on a site recently you'll see you don't need a gold card to be let loose.

I wasn't suggesting that all sites require JIB cards - I was merely pointing out that those that do will not permit someone with a black card but no gold card to carry out electrical work on site.

 

[Joshua]

With the relaxing of the criteria to get a black card. It won't be long until we turn up to a job that's being run by a 2 day wonder manager.

 

[FSU]

I'd rather keep my gold card than trade it for a black one anyway.

 

[Joshua]

The sites I've worked on over the last 7 years require a JIB card, even if it says Labourer on it they don't care. 90% of sites are the same.

 

[Dillb]

I wasn't suggesting that all sites require JIB cards - I was merely pointing out that those that do will not permit someone with a black card but no gold card to carry out electrical work on site.

Whats the issue, if as per the image the person is a electrical contracts manager then theybwill have electrical experience anyway.

 

[Joshua]

Whats the issue, if as per the image the person is a electrical contracts manager then theybwill have electrical experience anyway.

That's what I would hope but nope. No electrical experience whatsoever. You'll just do health and safety exam aimed at management and then you'll be able to apply for a card.

 

[Dillb]

That's what I would hope but nope. No electrical experience whatsoever. You'll just do health and safety exam aimed at management and then you'll be able to apply for a card.

No, you need certain credentials to get one.

Electrical Site Manager - https://www.ecscard.org.uk/card-types/management/electrical-site-manager

 

[Joshua]

No, you need certain credentials to get one.

Electrical Site Manager - https://www.ecscard.org.uk/card-types/management/electrical-site-manager

Not once they've changed the criteria. All you'd need is an SSSTS or equivalent health and safety exam. Which you can do in 2 days and its a guaranteed pass.

 

[Dillb]

Not once they've changed the criteria. All you'd need is an SSSTS or equivalent health and safety exam. Which you can do in 2 days and its a guaranteed pass.

Seeing as you obvioulsy didn’t read the link I posted. I will put it on here for you

“2. Have full company support and provide a job reference/ job description as part of an application.”

So you must have supporting documentation from your company to obtain the card.

 

[Risteard]

Whats the issue, if as per the image the person is a electrical contracts manager then theybwill have electrical experience anyway.

I don't have any issue with it!

 

[Dillb]

I don't have any issue with it!

Sorry my mistake, quoted the wrong post

 

[Gavin John Hyde]

Those cards won't bear the JIB logo though.

it appears they do have the jib logo on them, proud and centre on reverse... here is a example from the niceic website - niceic.com/goldcard

 

[Strima]

they already in effect give the gold cards away, if you are the QS for a NICEIC approved contractor and have been for 3 years then you can get a gold card for around £50... no NVQ or AM2 required!

I’ve been QS for five years but they won’t give me a gold card. Not that I want one.

 

[Joshua]

Seeing as you obvioulsy didn’t read the link I posted. I will put it on here for you

“2. Have full company support and provide a job reference/ job description as part of an application.”

So you must have supporting documentation from your company to obtain the card.

Sorry I don't think you understand what is happening.

As it stands until August you need either

An NVQ Level 4

Written letter confirming you have experience in your current position.

written letter confirming you have previous experience in a previous position.

Now they've scraped the need for a qualification and now under the new rules all you need is

Written letter confirming you have experience (Could be written by anyone)

An IOSH health and safety exam

Or an SMSTS / SSSTS (Which can be done in 2 days by any idiot with a pen)

You don't need any qualifications anymore. None of the new criteria states you need any qualifications to get a black card.

And then you'll get a Black site managers card and will be overseeing electrical works that you may not have any clue about, and in most cases the main contractor will see a black card and assume it's in line with a CSCS black card.

The confusion you've shown just proved my point that not many people understand fully what's happening to the industry.

Surely I can't be the only one who can see how damaging this can be?

 

[Dillb]

Sorry I don't think you understand what is happening.

As it stands until August you need either

An NVQ Level 4

Written letter confirming you have experience in your current position.

written letter confirming you have previous experience in a previous position.

Now they've scraped the need for a qualification and now under the new rules all you need is

Written letter confirming you have experience (Could be written by anyone)

An IOSH health and safety exam

Or an SMSTS / SSSTS (Which can be done in 2 days by any idiot with a pen)

You don't need any qualifications anymore. None of the new criteria states you need any qualifications to get a black card.

And then you'll get a Black site managers card and will be overseeing electrical works that you may not have any clue about, and in most cases the main contractor will see a black card and assume it's in line with a CSCS black card.

The confusion you've shown just proved my point that not many people understand fully what's happening to the industry.

Surely I can't be the only one who can see how damaging this can be?

No I see whats happening, but having seen lots of people with plenty of site experience move to management roles maybe it makes sense. Explain what you think is wrong with the new system, taking into account you need references from your employer to get the black card.

 

[Joshua]

No I see whats happening, but having seen lots of people with plenty of site experience move to management roles maybe it makes sense. Explain what you think is wrong with the new system, taking into account you need references from your employer to get the black card.

There's no proof that the letter you supply is from a genuine company. No checks are made on the ECS's part. The companies don't even need to be JIB registered. What's to stop a company who want to use a cheap manager by giving them a reference?

The health and safety qualifications listed are all guaranteed passes except maybe the IOSH one

The site manger card should be the same as the CSCS Black and Gold cards. No Qualifications no card.

 

[Dillb]

There's no proof that the letter you supply is from a genuine company. No checks are made on the ECS's part. The companies don't even need to be JIB registered. What's to stop a company who want to use a cheap manager by giving them a reference.

Even so. Whats the differemce between this and a labourers card which anyone can obtain after passing a multiple choice exam?

 

[Joshua]

Even so. Whats the differemce between this and a labourers card which anyone can obtain after passing a multiple choice exam?

A SSSTS 2 day course maybe?
Other than that no difference in the requirements for both

 

[Deleted member 26818]

I recently (5 or 6 weeks ago) phoned the JIB/ECS to enquire whether my SSSTS qualification could be added to my gold card.
The answer was no, but I could use the SSSTS instead of doing the H&S test when my gold card is up for renewal.
I was told that I could apply for a black card as well as my gold card, would have to make an application as for a new card and would need my company to make a declaration.

My other option would be to apply for a CSCS card.
If I were a plumber, then all I would have is a CSCS card, if I then passed the SSSTS exam, I could easily get it added.
Could wait until renewal or pay for for a replacement card now.