American conduit benders

[boogaloo]

Hello, as an electrician who frequently works in the United States as well as the UK, I was wondering why UK electricians don't adopt the US style conduit bender as shown below -
US UK

This style of bender comes in 3 sizes - 1/2 inch, 3/4 inch and 1 inch The 1 1/4 inch (32mm) is slightly different. This type of bender could easily be used to bend 20mm and 25mm conduit. It costs about the equivalent of 20-25 pounds for a complete handle and bend former, which is nothing, compared to the 500 pounds + cost of its UK counterpart.
It has a lot of things going for it -

1. 1000 + % Cheaper
2. Takes up 1,000 + % less room in the van.
3. Is 1000 + % Lighter
4. Gives the same amount of accuracy
5. Is easier to rework the conduit if needed , little tweaks and kicks are easier
6. Can be used to vice conduit with for cutting (Not in the manufacturers handbook but common practice
7. Easier to transport around site and can be used in smaller areas ie. attics, crawl spaces

I understand that the UK benders have a vice attachment too. The US bender does not. Is this the only thing stopping it from being adopted in the UK. My journeyman when I was an apprentice, remembers using a hickey to bend conduit was common practice which is not unsimilar to the US bender. Why did the UK electricians decide that it was better to carry around a 40lb 4 legged beast than develop the hickey to what the US electricians now have.
Having used both types of benders, there are many others, the triple nickel being my favourite, the US conduit is a far more user friendly and alltogether superior tool than the standard UK bender.
Thoughts on this would be appreciated.
Thanks for reading

 

[pennywise]

So how do the guys in US thread with no vice?

 

[johnboy6083]

do you have to carry a pipe vice around for threading though? if you have to carry around a heavy pipe vice anyway, then you might as well incorporate a bender into it, which i think is the reasoning behind the british design.

pennywise beat me to it!

 

[boogaloo]

Hello, as an electrician who frequently works in the United States as well as the UK, I was wondering why UK electricians don't adopt the US style conduit bender as shown below -
View attachment 3517 US View attachment 3518 UK

This style of bender comes in 3 sizes - 1/2 inch, 3/4 inch and 1 inch The 1 1/4 inch (32mm) is slightly different. This type of bender could easily be used to bend 20mm and 25mm conduit. It costs about the equivalent of 20-25 pounds for a complete handle and bend former, which is nothing, compared to the 500 pounds + cost of its UK counterpart.
It has a lot of things going for it -

1. 1000 + % Cheaper
2. Takes up 1,000 + % less room in the van.
3. Is 1000 + % Lighter
4. Gives the same amount of accuracy
5. Is easier to rework the conduit if needed , little tweaks and kicks are easier
6. Can be used to vice conduit with for cutting (Not in the manufacturers handbook but common practice
7. Easier to transport around site and can be used in smaller areas ie. attics, crawl spaces

I understand that the UK benders have a vice attachment too. The US bender does not. Is this the only thing stopping it from being adopted in the UK. My journeyman when I was an apprentice, remembers using a hickey to bend conduit was common practice which is not unsimilar to the US bender. Why did the UK electricians decide that it was better to carry around a 40lb 4 legged beast than develop the hickey to what the US electricians now have.
Having used both types of benders, there are many others, the triple nickel being my favourite, the US conduit is a far more user friendly and alltogether superior tool than the standard UK bender. I am British.
Thoughts on this would be appreciated.
Thanks for reading

 

[ringer]

I was looking for a 'US-style' conduit bender a little while ago, thinking they would be relatively cheap because I only do a little bit of conduit work, but could not find one in the uk. Didn't look terribly hard, but got nothing on searches, just the expensive ones.

 

[pennywise]

do you have to carry a pipe vice around for threading though? if you have to carry around a heavy pipe vice anyway, then you might as well incorporate a bender into it, which i think is the reasoning behind the british design.

pennywise beat me to it!

Great minds think alike, have a gander on Youtube there are plenty of vids showing people using the US version some of the attempts are hilarious

 

[Adam W]

I think plumbers use something similar to the US style conduit bender.
I would imagine the reason sparks use massive heavy bending machines is because they are capable of exerting greater pressure on the tube, which may not be necessary when working copper as it is softer.

Having never used American imperial sized tube I couldn't comment on the quality, but it would make sense if it were lighter grade, hence only needing a plumbers style bender.

 

[ian.settle1]

How thick is the wall on American conduit as the american bender in my opinion would not touch UK conduit

 

[Adam W]

I think plumbers use something similar in the UK.
I would guess the reason they can use a smaller bender is because copper is a lot softer than steel - matey in this guide is using a bending spring and his actual knee to bend copper pipe, as you would with pvc tube.

Having never used American imperial sized conduit I couldn't comment on it's quality but I would guess it's softer and easier to bend than the stuff we get here.

 

[Adam W]

Hang on a sec... Did you start this topic twice?

 

[Deleted member 26818]

My understanding is that this is for use with Aluminium tubing.

 

[Deleted member 26818]

I believe it's aluminium.

 

[malcolmsanford]

We've had conduit benders for years in the industry, you cut a piece 4" x 4" to about as long as your waist, at an end you drill a 25mm^ at a 45 angle at other end a 32mm^ at same angle and away you co, we call them "Hicky Blocks" but sure they are called many things

 

[Sparky Ninja]

When I started my old boss made me do some bends the way he used to, bending tube on trees and drains.

 

[Marvo]

I haven't seen a spec calling for threaded steel conduit for several years and even then it was the old government specs for navy buildings and parliament in Cape Town etc.

If steel conduit is required for some reason we use the knock together Bosal stuff. You can bend this on the floor using your foot and the 'American' style bender shown above but they also supply a range of prefabricated bends etc and no threading is needed.

I'm not a big fan of the steel conduit installations. Being in a coastal area, after a few years the internal corrosion in the conduit makes it nearly impossible to pull new wires through and to make even small alterations means an extra van full of equipment to bend and thread.

Is the threaded steel conduit still standard installation in the UK?

 

[Engineer54]

The conduit the Yanks use mostly is EMT (electrical metalic tube) No threading on this type of conduit, as it's similar to our old slip conduit where connections rely on ''machine screw'' couplings etc. The installations in this type of conduit look terrible to say the least. The conduit system that is of the screwed type in the States, is called RST (Ridged Steel tubing) which is very similar to our own conduit. The electricians will normally have a motorised threading machine when installing RST. Which i might add is a dammed sight heavier to carry about than the UK style of bending/vice set-up!!! The other thing that no-one has mentioned is that the Yanks go by internal diamentions and the rest of the world use external diamentions of conduit. So i'm not sure that the Yank pipe benders formers will be suitable for the UKs metric sizes...

Yes, .....threaded steel conduit still considered standard installation in the UK!!!

 

[ian.settle1]

The conduit the Yanks use mostly is EMT (electrical metalic tube) No threading on this type of conduit, as it's similar to our old slip conduit where connections rely on ''machine screw'' couplings etc. The installations in this type of conduit look terrible to say the least. The conduit system that is of the screwed type in the States, is called RST (Ridged Steel tubing) which is very similar to our own conduit. The electricians will normally have a motorised threading machine when installing RST. Which i might add is a dammed sight heavier to carry about than the UK style of bending/vice set-up!!! The other thing that no-one has mentioned is that the Yanks go by internal diamentions and the rest of the world use external diamentions of conduit. So i'm not sure that the Yank pipe benders formers will be suitable for the UKs metric sizes...

Yes, .....threaded steel conduit still considered standard installation in the UK!!!

Yanks have to be totally different to everyone else and they think everyone should change to their way of thinking.

 

[Engineer54]

Yep, ....Pretty much like them hanging on for dear life with there AWG!!! Even the Canadians use metric sized wiring and cables these days, along with those other countries that are, or have been influenced by the Yanks electrical NEC code. ...The Septic's are gonna have to change sooner or later...lol!!

 

[malcolmsanford]

3/.029 = 1.5 mm^ 7/.029 = 2.5 mm^ 7/.044 v= 6.0 mm^ 19/.052 = 25.0 mm^ Etc etc

Did have a certain charm to them though

 

[ian.settle1]

Yep, ....Pretty much like them hanging on for dear life with there AWG!!! Even the Canadians use metric sized wiring and cables these days, along with those other countries that are, or have been influenced by the Yanks electrical NEC code. ...The Septic's are gonna have to change sooner or later...lol!!

It'a Sceptics not Septics