Fitting new consumer board - no part p?

[tomodo]

Hi guys my friends ask me to replace his consumer board Ive been qualified for a year or so have my nvq level 3 but no inspection and testing yet! What are the rules for doing it? Is it okay for me to install it and then get an experienced part p registered electrician I know to test and certify it? Is this also legal? And also when I do get my 2394 and 2395 how do I go about doing one off jobs without becoming part p? Cheers be grateful for replys

 

[Deleted member 38070]

if its notifiable work, you'll have to be with a competant person scheme, if your just changing accessories like for like then not, consumer is notifiable...

 

[telectrix]

are you competent to do it? do you have the necxessary test gear to test and certify?

if yes to both, then just ge --- done.

the part pee police might prosecute you if yo make a balls-up and injure someone.

 

[Anthony S]

if its notifiable work, you'll have to be with a competant person scheme, if your just changing accessories like for like then not, consumer is notifiable...i did hear about a third party being able to sign work off for you, but i think that was stopped recently...?

They are a live and kicking

 

[tomodo]

No test equipment so that's a no go. Just wondering what the law was?

 

[Anthony S]

No test equipment so that's a no go. Just wondering what the law was?

Third party certification is an option.

 

[Octopus]

So lacking in experience, no test kit and no membership.

Any PL insurance?

Me thinks you should walk away or if you do it, make sure you buy your horse some more straw.

 

[Deleted member 38070]

dont touch anything without test gear, how do you know you've not got any underlying faults? dont touch it...

 

[TJ Anderson]

Third party certification is an option.

I had an email yesterday, Stroma are giving it to members for free. I get the feeling Building Control can't be arsed with Part P now and this third party certification will stop them getting asked to arrange contractors.

 

[tomodo]

We'll it'll get tested after it's been installed so why should that be a problem? Seems a lot of money to get registered if I'm not doing it as a business. Work full time as maintenance in a factory thanks for the replys

 

[tomodo]

What do stroma do tj?

 

[Octopus]

We'll it'll get tested after it's been installed so why should that be a problem? Seems a lot of money to get registered if I'm not doing it as a business. Work full time as maintenance in a factory thanks for the replys

So what are you going to do when the RCDs are tripping?

 

[tomodo]

Do some fault finding maybe?

 

[Octopus]

Do some fault finding maybe?

How and with what?

 

[TJ Anderson]

We'll it'll get tested after it's been installed so why should that be a problem? Seems a lot of money to get registered if I'm not doing it as a business. Work full time as maintenance in a factory thanks for the replys

What if you have insulation faults, you won't know until you turn it on and the RCD wont stay in.

 

[tomodo]

With the registered electrician who's coming round to test it

 

[tomodo]

There's no one living in it at the moment so power can stay off if there is a fault

 

[TJ Anderson]

What do stroma do tj?

NAPIT and Stroma Members can do third party certification for notifiable jobs.

 

[baldsparkies]

So you pull the fuse, rip the board out, and wonder why those VIR's are crumbling before your eyes.
And that's just the beginning !!
Look before you jump, that's the Grand Canyon looming before you.

 

[Anthony S]

I had an email yesterday, Stroma are giving it to members for free. I get the feeling Building Control can't be arsed with Part P now and this third party certification will stop them getting asked to arrange contractors.

So for £288 all in you get the Third party certification thrown in as well ?

 

[nickblake]

Realistically you should never consider doing a consumer unit change without carrying out some basic tests , whats the cable is it PVC or the good old VIR , what about bonding to services water gas oil etc these i name a few and as beens mentioned insurance

 

[TJ Anderson]

So for £288 all in you get the Third party certification thrown in as well ?

Yes, exactly that mate

 

[Octopus]

There's no one living in it at the moment so power can stay off if there is a fault

Wind Up or moron?

 

[newtothis]

Building Control can't be arsed.

Yes that's very true.
The fees they charge for the exact same service varies from council to council.
The councils that really can't be with BC demonstrate this by charging a much higher fee.

 

[amlu]

get yourself a tester mate, no need for £500 new shiny one, second hand machine doing insulation resistance and continuity will do, every electrician should have one and know how to use it...

 

[Anthony S]

Yes, exactly that mate

I detest the scam providers, but for that sort of money even I'm getting excited lol

 

[Pete999]

We'll it'll get tested after it's been installed so why should that be a problem? Seems a lot of money to get registered if I'm not doing it as a business. Work full time as maintenance in a factory thanks for the replys

tomodo, leave it alone, no test gear how can you do it, never ever change a CU without testing the entire installation before you rip the old CU out, you are installing a CU wit RCDs in it, just think about that.

 

[SirKit Breaker]

No test equipment so that's a no go. Just wondering what the law was?

The law is "The Electricity at Work regulations 1989". This is what you will be prosecuted under if it goes bad. A lot of people think that this law doesn't apply to Domestic Installations, they are wrong, if you are doing stuff in your own house it doesn't because it can't be enforced, but if you do it in someone else's, it does and you will get crucified.

Building Regulation Part P is also the law.

Cheers.............Howard

 

[baldsparkies]

Sorry, and I mean know disrespect to the OP.
But reading through this thread your simply not ready to approach the task at hand.
Remember,
Being competent has never been about what you know.
Its about knowing what you don't know.
1st stage is to have the whole installation thoroughly tested as per an EICR.
Don't need to complete the whole form if factored into your price but you need to visually check the installation and record readings for your benefit.
Once you have identified any dangers or non compliant problems you can tackle the job issuing an installation cert after completion.
Part P registration is as much, if not more, for your friends benefit.
You need an established qualified sparky at your side and run through the job with him.
That's my honest opinion, and advice. :icon12:

 

[Engineer54]

So for £288 all in you get the Third party certification thrown in as well ?

Plus.... Insurances, test equipment, other sundries and paperwork etc...

 

[Engineer54]

Duplicate.....

 

[trev]

Hi guys my friends ask me to replace his consumer board Ive been qualified for a year or so have my nvq level 3

So you say that

There's no one living in it at the moment so power can stay off if there is a fault

Then you say you're going to rely on the bang test.
Aye, fair enough mate.

 

[Geordie Spark]

So what are you going to do when the RCDs are tripping?

You KNOW the answer to that already don't you??


"HELP my RCD keeps tripping .............."

 

[Simonslimline]

if its notifiable work, you'll have to be with a competent person scheme, if your just changing accessories like for like then not, consumer is notifiable...

Not strictly true.

 

[Geordie Spark]

Not strictly true.

Another urban myth about to be shot to ribbons ..... :73:

 

[tomodo]

Lol cheers for the replys think ill buy meself a tester before to give it a check then take it from there

 

[Guest77]

So what are you going to do when the RCDs are tripping?

Take them out and stick a double pole switch in of course :biggrin:

 

[Guest77]

Lol cheers for the replys think ill buy meself a tester before to give it a check then take it from there

Rollox, don't lie, we are not like you, we actually have intelligence.

 

[marc8]

Hi all
before part P came in what did you do on a CU change we did the same as every body else 16th edition install all circuits turn it on if RCD holds the system was fine.
Only difference now is part P & don't get me wrong I am all for it as long at it policed properly which it's not. I still know people who do cash installs who do a couple of test mainly LE Ne M ohms & earth tests & F... All else. It still goes on.

 

[Guest77]

Gasp!!! Tonto where is the trough? silver is hungry

 

[Octopus]

Hi all
before part P came in what did you do on a CU change we did the same as every body else 16th edition install all circuits turn it on if RCD holds the system was fine.
Only difference now is part P & don't get me wrong I am all for it as long at it policed properly which it's not. I still know people who do cash installs who do a couple of test mainly LE Ne M ohms & earth tests & F... All else. It still goes on.

Part P or no Part P, I wouldn't install a new CU without some pre install tests, nor miss out all the circuit testing, nor issueing an EIC.

 

[nickblake]

Hi all
before part P came in what did you do on a CU change we did the same as every body else 16th edition install all circuits turn it on if RCD holds the system was fine.
Only difference now is part P & don't get me wrong I am all for it as long at it policed properly which it's not. I still know people who do cash installs who do a couple of test mainly LE Ne M ohms & earth tests & F... All else. It still goes on.

Absolute rubbish not every one else i can assure you , and they will be they ones who will eventually end up in court

 

[Knobhead]

Wind Up or moron?

Wind up, no one could be as moronic as the OP makes out.

 

[trev]

Hi all
before part P came in what did you do on a CU change we did the same as every body else 16th edition install all circuits turn it on if RCD holds the system was fine.
Only difference now is part P & don't get me wrong I am all for it as long at it policed properly which it's not. I still know people who do cash installs who do a couple of test mainly LE Ne M ohms & earth tests & F... All else. It still goes on.

I can assure you that before part p was introduced the vast majority of electricians worth their salt did exactly the same as they're doing now.
Pre tests, CU change, full test, cert.
You're talking utter nonsense and if that's what you used to do then you should hang your head in shame

 

[7029 dave]

Hi all
before part P came in what did you do on a CU change we did the same as every body else 16th edition install all circuits turn it on if RCD holds the system was fine.
Only difference now is part P & don't get me wrong I am all for it as long at it policed properly which it's not. I still know people who do cash installs who do a couple of test mainly LE Ne M ohms & earth tests & F... All else. It still goes on.

I would agree with you 30 odd years ago, and I won't say why just yet (privatisation is the clue).

 

[SPARTYKUS]

Take them out and stick a double pole switch in of course :biggrin:

Or even worse, I've seen the RCD installed but unresponsive, some nugget had actually cracked it in half along the seam of the casing and bodged a piece of 16mm cable to bridge the top and bottom. And TAPED it together.

 

[empress]

crack on m8 every tom dick or harry is having a go anyway ,Part **** is a joke.
we,ve all see the thousands of prosecutions for failing to notify building control.
every year i wonder why i bother paying for this shambles

 

[Skimpy Wan]

I'm interested to know what "pre-checks" you undertake (rather than a full test), prior to replacing the board - Ze, Polarity, IR each circuit, check main bonding etc?

 

[spark 68]

I'm interested to know what "pre-checks" you undertake (rather than a full test), prior to replacing the board - Ze, Polarity, IR each circuit, check main bonding etc?

In addition to above I like to whip the upstairs/downstairs passage landing light switches off for a quick look to see if I am likely to face a borrowed N situation, plus to see if there are CPCs present on the lighting, a quick visual as you can tell early doors if the wiring has been hacked about/bodged DIYed etc. plus a quick clamp of the tails with my earth leakage clamp meter to see if I am likely to face RCD tripping problems, oh and I don't usually IR test every circuit at this stage usually just a quick global L+N to E.

I usually spend no more than say a half hour doing this at the quoting stage, this has paid off every time and being well worth the time and effort spent, this tells me if it is going to be fairly straight forward or a complete ball ache of a job, and I can quote accordingly , I never "formally" record anything at this stage just a few notes for myself, and never give the client any of the results at this point either.

I learnt the hard way lol, only the once though!

 

[Engineer54]

Suitable tests to give you an indication that you don't have any pre-existing faults or a shared neutral situation between up and down stairs lighting circuits. Failure to do pre-testing can lead to a whole lot of problems on a CU change with RCD's tripping etc.

And typically just as you were thinking of or looking forward to going home too... lol!!