Bonding Gas Supply in an Outbuilding

[shanky887614]

544.1.2 says "The main protective bonding connection to any gas, water or other service shall be made as near as practicable to the point of entry of that service into the premises."

Since it refers to the point of entry of the service, rather than the point of entry of the pipework, it appears to be saying that, even if the reason that the copper pipework is extraneous is that it feeds out underground in copper, the main bond should still be made at the incoming point.

wrong.

then a block of flats only has bonding on the intake into the building and nothing in the flats?

each seperate building requires bonding in this case the house and outbuilding both need bonding

 

[HandySparks]

wrong.

then a block of flats only has bonding on the intake into the building and nothing in the flats?

each seperate building requires bonding in this case the house and outbuilding both need bonding

You misunderstand my point.

The regs seem to be saying that extraneous pipework have to be bonded where the supply (water/gas) enters, rather than at the point that makes the pipework extraneous, which could be where another building or an outside tap is supplied.

 

[Geordie Spark]

Never found the need to use that particular picture book Dave... lol!!

Here's me thinking you wrote the book!

 

[shanky887614]

You misunderstand my point.

The regs seem to be saying that extraneous pipework have to be bonded where the supply (water/gas) enters, rather than at the point that makes the pipework extraneous, which could be where another building or an outside tap is supplied.

if it is a seperate building its a seperate premises

 

[Simlec]

You misunderstand my point.

The regs seem to be saying that extraneous pipework have to be bonded where the supply (water/gas) enters, rather than at the point that makes the pipework extraneous, which could be where another building or an outside tap is supplied.

You need to drop the supply part, it could be uni-strut with tray that enters the building from outside in contact with ground. Supply service is just an example.

 

[davesparks]

if it is a seperate building its a seperate premises

Not necessarily, but there could be more than one premises within a building.

 

[specs]

Just bond it
, I would

 

[HandySparks]

You need to drop the supply part, it could be uni-strut with tray that enters the building from outside in contact with ground. Supply service is just an example.

I agree that main bonding may be required to extraneous parts other than services. However, where it is a service, 544.1.2 defines where the bonding connection should be made, namely where the service enters the premises.

 

[davesparks]

I agree that main bonding may be required to extraneous parts other than services. However, where it is a service, 544.1.2 defines where the bonding connection should be made, namely where the service enters the premises.

Neither the gas nor the water in the outbuilding in the OP is entering the premises though, yet one certainly needs bonding and the other might.

 

[HandySparks]

Neither the gas nor the water in the outbuilding in the OP is entering the premises though, yet one certainly needs bonding and the other might.

Yes, I've drifted away from the OP and was speaking more generally.

 

[Deleted member 26818]

I take it no one bothered to google the definition then?
BS7671 requires us to bond any conductive part which enters the building from outside, which may introduce a difference in potential.
There is no requirement to bond conductive parts that do not enter the building from outside.
The plastic water pipe is not conductive, so does not require bonding.
The internal copper water pipes are conductive, but as they do not enter the building from outside, they cannot introduce a difference in potential, and therefore also do not require bonding.

 

[TJ Anderson]

I take it no one bothered to google the definition then?
BS7671 requires us to bond any conductive part which enters the building from outside, which may introduce a difference in potential.
There is no requirement to bond conductive parts that do not enter the building from outside.
The plastic water pipe is not conductive, so does not require bonding.
The internal copper water pipes are conductive, but as they do not enter the building from outside, they cannot introduce a difference in potential, and therefore also do not require bonding.

I quoted the definition in previous post. What difference does it make if it becomes extraneous within the building or outside. If conductive pipework was buried in the floor of the house it could become extraneous.

 

[Deleted member 26818]

I quoted the definition in previous post. What difference does it make if it becomes extraneous within the building or outside. If conductive pipework was buried in the floor of the house it could become extraneous.

You quoted the definition of an extraneous-conductive part, not the definition of extraneous.
It doesn't make any difference, as it's physically impossible for something that is entirely inside a building to also be extraneous.
If the copper pipework were buried in the ground, then the part that is in the ground (no longer inside the building) would be extraneous, and where the copper pipework re-entered the building would require bonding.
However as far as I'm aware, the copper pipework does not exit then re-enter the building.

 

[Geordie Spark]

Twenty three HOURS and fifty four posts later and you're all still arguing about this bloody copper pipe!!

How long would it have taken to find out by testing the damned thing with a meter & long bit of wire???

and it's you lot who think plumbers are a bit mentally challenged!! :laugh:

 

[Engineer54]

Staying with the OP's outbuilding installation, if the metal water pipework that's fed/connected to a incoming plastic pipe, enters the slab internally, say to supply something on the other side of the room it would be prudent to test for being extraneous. Which is going to be pretty certain that it will be, especially if it's been tied to the slabs rebar grid, and therefore will require main bonding. If however it's just been visibly clipped internally to the walls, it's unlikely that it will be extraneous and main bonding will not be required.

The incoming gas pipe goes without saying, will be an extraneous conductive part that will require main bonding...

And that just about clears everything up as far as these two services are concerned with this OP's outbuilding query!!!

 

[Knobhead]

Twenty three HOURS and fifty four posts later and you're all still arguing about this bloody copper pipe!!

How long would it have taken to find out by testing the damned thing with a meter & long bit of wire???

and it's you lot who think plumbers are a bit mentally challenged!! :laugh:

This is the tilers forum! What do you expect?

 

[Knobhead]

The IET mandarins must be howling with laughter at the farce they’ve created!

Bring back the 15th.
Non of this is it, isn’t it, slap a bit of wire on it then it isn’t.

From the OED

Irrelevant or unrelated to the subject being dealt with: one is obliged to wade through many pages of extraneous material.

 

[richy3333]

Whoever did this was either confused or trying to make sure 'belt and braces' style. The incomer for the water before the stopcock is plastic. The floor it passes through is chipboard and the pipe drops down into a solem/void (timber building raised up on blocks). After the stopcock and meter it's all copper either clipped to joists or in stud walls.

 

[shanky887614]

View attachment 28056
Whoever did this was either confused or trying to make sure 'belt and braces' style. The incomer for the water before the stopcock is plastic. The floor it passes through is chipboard and the pipe drops down into a solem/void (timber building raised up on blocks). After the stopcock and meter it's all copper either clipped to joists or in stud walls.

nothing wrong with belt and braces, i wear them when its cold (attached to my sellopets)

 

[Geordie Spark]

This is the tilers forum! What do you expect?

I know it is!!

I'm still trying to work that one out!