skill been taken out the trade?

[baldsparkies]

No the skill has not been taken out the trade - It's just not regulated .DIY programmes don't help -
Ask the average house basher ( excluding proper sparkies I hasten to add ) about volt drop . earth loops and correction factors and he won't have a clue

Here,here, Bugsy.
Its all about what kind of electrical work you have covered in your working life as a sparks. I have been fortunate enough to have run large electrical contracts working to specifications and drawings along with meetings with electrical consultants, Quants surveyors, architects and the like although you are into an entirely different ball game. Composit panels as opposed to a simple consumer units. Lighting control equipment, power factor correction, submains supplies and 3 phase control panels for mechanical heating and vent, Fire alarm systems that need to interact with other services, the list is endless. But its all about how far you need to go in your trade. A good domestic electrician who has never worked on anything else is still a good electrician, so we are back to competance and my comments in an earlier post. Thats the plus about our trade, variety and a learning curve that is with you throughout. I am 56 started my apprentiship at 18 and still learning. If you want a thorn in the side of the trade, then look no further than part P. Its created an absolute shambles in the domestic world and thats not just my opinion .

 

[gaffer]

Gaffer,

Apologies if this seems like nit-picking but I've always thought crimping MICC is a bit of a no-no. Best bet I would have thought is connector block. I've worked with a mob that had this as a one of the questions in their trrade test and it has caught a lot of lads out. I think crimping any solid cores is a non-starter although I'm willing to be corrected.

Cheers,

Cueball

Sorry if you feel like you are nit picking,I always welcome any input from others.I think the down side is maybe the risk of damage from heat to insulated crimps.Dont know of any problems crimping on solid cores?

 

[lee sandland]

hi ,ive just started a so called quick course and having reading a lot of post on this site there is alot of negatived about people trying to change there lives and better themselfs with a new career.
I was in the exhibition & shopfitting trade for 12 years and employed 20 labourers working all over uk and europe ,but when thay close the coal mines the miners came in cheaper(don't blame them thay needed work) and it was just me and my van.So i had to change my career and trained as a chef at the age of 30 and had the same type of comments then ,now at 42 trying to move on and you get the same negatived ,Sorry but times have changed and people don't do the same job for 40 years or more.
To me has long there are regs to control cowboys your jobs well be safe.
thanks lee

 

[baldsparkies]

To me has long there are regs to control cowboys your jobs well be safe.
thanks lee

Its a nice thought Lee, but regs to control cowboys There's no such thing.
Since when as a cowboy taken any notice of regulations??.

 

[Jason Smith]

The average house basher- i come from an intensive course and I was trained in volt drop and correction factors, I am going to assume you are really not sufficiently informed to make comment.
Please confine your comments to persons not properly qualified. You cannot blanket every person and every course.

 

[lee sandland]

Its a nice thought Lee, but regs to control cowboys There's no such thing.
Since when as a cowboy taken any notice of regulations??.

Thanks ,but my point was that poeple doing these quick courses was not good enough to be a eletrician or join your trade when all i (or we) do is study and work and pay alot of money for it ,it's not just for the money it's for our future and a new skill .
and there are always chancers in any trade ,but the new laws coming in in 2015 should stop the cowboys
many thanks lee

 

[gazzamikes]

I think that the colleges etc should teach more of the support systems such as tray and steel conduit. I'm a maintenance engeer, without the skills I've gained over five years of engineering training trying to do metallic support systems would have been very difficult. I completed the2330 last summer and in our group was a posty, never used a hacksaw or benders in his life, he struggled in his practical exam for 6 hours and gave up. More training needs to be given

 

[lee sandland]

I think that the colleges etc should teach more of the support systems such as tray and steel conduit. I'm a maintenance engeer, without the skills I've gained over five years of engineering training trying to do metallic support systems would have been very difficult. I completed the2330 last summer and in our group was a posty, never used a hacksaw or benders in his life, he struggled in his practical exam for 6 hours and gave up. More training needs to be given

It's like all trades if you want do something you put in the effort and try to learn moor .it took me 5 years at collage to learn my ex trade and 7 years still learning it

 

[MarcT]

Not so long ago, electricians were regarded as electrical craftsmen, and the path was more linear. If it was electrical in nature then you could turn your hand to it and add another string to your bow. Since then ,the trade has become more diverse and lateral in it's progression. You may no longer be judged by your ability to do something , and be judged only on what you have done before, especially in what has become a buyers market.
When these intensive courses came out, I was very dubious, not because I thought my achievements would be usurped, but because I thought the course providers were out for a quick buck. The training now costs a fraction, and has to be completed in a fraction of the time. However, if this is the only way into the trade now, and it's producing competent people then good for them. To be able to retain so much information and pass the exams in such a short time is really quite something, and to those who pass, it shows a dedication. I'm not aware of all the reasons for disliking these courses, but one might be grieving for the passing of a traditional rite of passage, which looks irrevocably destined to history. If there is one single thing that is cheapening our craft, it's not the new induction structure, it's GREED! Builders who know the cost of everything and the value of nothing. Who do their own electrics because they think you're ripping them off. Who employ cheap lawless foreign labour only to charge top whack for it anyway. Contractors who have one decent QS on the books who shows the inspector round their 'best' jobs while the rest of the mob fling some atrocity in down the round, but don't worry, they can always send an 'improver' round afterwards. WTF is an 'improver‘.? Why didn't you do the damn job properly the first ******* time?

Anyway, I've slid off topic a bit here, and starting to feel like Jessica Fletcher!
back on topic, It doesn't matter where you passed your exams now, it's the knowledge and experience you gain, retain and share with others that makes you. It's all one big learning arc anyway.

 

[lee sandland]

Not so long ago, electricians were regarded as electrical craftsmen, and the path was more linear. If it was electrical in nature then you could turn your hand to it and add another string to your bow. Since then ,the trade has become more diverse and lateral in it's progression. You may no longer be judged by your ability to do something , and be judged only on what you have done before, especially in what has become a buyers market.
When these intensive courses came out, I was very dubious, not because I thought my achievements would be usurped, but because I thought the course providers were out for a quick buck. The training now costs a fraction, and has to be completed in a fraction of the time. However, if this is the only way into the trade now, and it's producing competent people then good for them. To be able to retain so much information and pass the exams in such a short time is really quite something, and to those who pass, it shows a dedication. I'm not aware of all the reasons for disliking these courses, but one might be grieving for the passing of a traditional rite of passage, which looks irrevocably destined to history. If there is one single thing that is cheapening our craft, it's not the new induction structure, it's GREED! Builders who know the cost of everything and the value of nothing. Who do their own electrics because they think you're ripping them off. Who employ cheap lawless foreign labour only to charge top whack for it anyway. Contractors who have one decent QS on the books who shows the inspector round their 'best' jobs while the rest of the mob fling some atrocity in down the round, but don't worry, they can always send an 'improver' round afterwards. WTF is an 'improver‘.? Why didn't you do the damn job properly the first ******* time?

Anyway, I've slid off topic a bit here, and starting to feel like Jessica Fletcher!
back on topic, It doesn't matter where you passed your exams now, it's the knowledge and experience you gain, retain and share with others that makes you. It's all one big learning arc anyway.

well i agree with everything you say( miss fletcher lol)life is full of learning and in all trades there are con artists and foreign labour is bring this country to it's knees