Whats wrong with Britain

[dingledong]

I am not blaming all Muslims ,yet again trev you take it to extremes if I went to the church of the seventh day Adventists and 2 started knocking on doors and shooting people as a member of that church I would stand up and condemn what had happened and I would think a lot of others would disassociate themselves from the killers

Wouldn't you ?
Or dillb
Or even mdj
Surely you would but maybe your badder than what I thought

 

[dingledong]

I haven't decided whether you are on LSD, coke, Heroin, Ketamin or something else yet dongle lol

Can you get me some ? I will be quite

 

[dingledong]

Maybe I am on drugs just posted twice sorry

 

[Guest77]

Night Lads, Night Dongle, don't stay up too late, you may get caught out by the daylight

 

[tomfj]

the reason most health budgets in the world are increasing is that we now have things called orphan drugs which are the most amazing drugs that cure diseases that were incurable but they only affect a tiny portion of the world population, as in 1000s not millions. as such they only way to make them economic for the drug companies to make is to charge £100000 per treatment but that's a lot of money that wouldn't have been spent before as in a lot of cases the patient would have died.its a really crap reality that now we have drugs to cure the incurable that there too expensive to use. NICE has a certain budget in which it has to pay for these small patient group expensive targeted drugs and the majority not quite as expensive drugs ,the maths suck

 

[Plonker 3]

What exactly would we be apologising for? If it was a direct member of my family or a good friend of mine yes I would apologise. But someone whom I linked to by default with no knowledge of them the no I wouldn't.

Have you apologised to the MP whose daughter was killed by electric shock which led to the introduction of Part P?

 

[trev]

I am not blaming all Muslims ,yet again trev you take it to extremes if I went to the church of the seventh day Adventists and 2 started knocking on doors and shooting people as a member of that church I would stand up and condemn what had happened and I would think a lot of others would disassociate themselves from the killers

Wouldn't you ?
Or dillb
Or even mdj
Surely you would but maybe your badder than what I thought

No I have not taken it to extremes. You (and a couple of others)have implied that all muslims are culpable for the actions of a tiny minority, all I've tried to do is make it plain how utterly ridiculous that is.
I've worked in the heaviest muslim country of all, Saudi Arabia. At no time did I ever feel threatened by the populace there, I was never made to feel uncomfortable, no one wanted to convert me, no one wanted to kill me
I've done a boat load of work for the muslim community in my area, they have always made me feel welcome in their homes and business premises.
People are people where ever you go, most are completely sound. Some are arseholes.
BUT the vast majority of us all want pretty much the same things, we want to live in peace and be able to get on with doing what we do to earn a living to provide a better life for our kids than we had. To put a few quid away for when times get hard and to have enough to allow us to allow ourselves whatever we think the good things in life are.

 

[dingledong]

Please reread my posts yes I said Muslims should stand up and condemn the atrocities but no one does even from the mosque that the killers come from no one does
Also using the seventh day Adventists I am sure that if some people committed murders in t h e name of the s d A's that other people who have the same beliefs would condemn the killers even if they did not know them as the killers are saying the are killing for Allah they are killing for Muslims
That's stupid the mp's daughter died not on purpose it was an accident it was wrong and the man should get life but it was an accident, she was not killed for a religious reason was she and we are discussing people being killed because of a religion

 

[trev]

https://www.google.co.uk/url?sa=t&r...=RPyO8xdF7d8tyoUQlIjoCw&bvm=bv.72676100,d.ZGU

https://www.google.co.uk/url?sa=t&r...=326GgO0mPzFHsxR2VKnuWw&bvm=bv.72676100,d.ZGU

https://www.google.co.uk/url?sa=t&r...=_Szb8Mrwf8gLvbqmMoqJoQ&bvm=bv.72676100,d.ZGU

There's 3 to be going on with

 

[tidyboiler]

my parents are pensioners on state pensions and don't struggle in the slightest. NICE are the people responsible for the drugs we can or can't have and the wouldn't pay for them even if we had a zero overseas aid budget. We do what we can for people in need.

Well I work for the NHS so I think I'll just agree to disagree with you

 

[Slowhand]

https://www.google.co.uk/url?sa=t&r...=RPyO8xdF7d8tyoUQlIjoCw&bvm=bv.72676100,d.ZGU

https://www.google.co.uk/url?sa=t&r...=326GgO0mPzFHsxR2VKnuWw&bvm=bv.72676100,d.ZGU

https://www.google.co.uk/url?sa=t&r...=_Szb8Mrwf8gLvbqmMoqJoQ&bvm=bv.72676100,d.ZGU

There's 3 to be going on with

You've obviously never heard of taquia.

 

[Plonker 3]

So if that's the counter argument how are they supposed to apologise if that's what you want them to do?

 

[trev]

You've obviously never hard of taquia.

So if they say nothing then they're complicit.
If they condemn it they're lying.
Damned if you do, damned if you don't.
That's a really clever outlook isn't it?
Not.

 

[dingledong]

2points then
1 more should be said more should come out in the media not in add places only you can find
2. Why are they saying anything as dillb seems to think that they shouldn't but they are

 

[Slowhand]

So if they say nothing then they're complicit.
If they condemn it they're lying.
Damned if you do, damned if you don't.
That's a really clever outlook isn't it?
Not.

Nope, it means the can lie through their teeth to kuffars for any reason they like.

 

[Plonker 3]

They don't have to apologise, but if they do that's there choice.

i am still waiting for your answer to the question I asked in #82

 

[dingledong]

So if that's the counter argument how are they supposed to apologise if that's what you want them to do?

No it's you that are saying they shouldn't apologise ,I think this should go into daily papers and local papers myself

 

[trev]

Those 3 things I found took me about 15 seconds on google. They're not publicised because the media needs you to have someone to hate and muslims are the easy target. 60 or 70 years ago it would have been Jews.
The second bit comes back to what I said above, you want them to condemn extremism but when they do they're accused of lying. So you want them to say something but then object when they do.
Clever, really clever.

 

[edexlab]

You will always get splinter groups in any situation its human nature even at a basic level people form cliques where they belong to a larger group and we've all experienced this in some form or another where a group of people stick to themselves have their own views and accept certain individuals in and keep others out, unfortunately extremists do the same thing and learn quickly that telling others your ideas willy nilly equals trouble, like the saying birds of a feather....these groups will always spot the type of personality that fits into their idealism .

Personally I don't think the majority of people who associate with terrorists and the like actually know who they really are, until something happens, they more than likely realise that they appear to be on the radical side.

As for the extremist preaching from all religions we only have to look here on the forum to see how a "book" can be interpreted differently by individuals and misinformation spread.

 

[dingledong]

So if they say nothing then they're complicit.
If they condemn it they're lying.
Damned if you do, damned if you don't.
That's a really clever outlook isn't it?
Not.

Have I said they are lieing I said they should stand up and condemn and in daily newspapers etc etc
So again not reading what I am saying and changing the facts where did I say living
Why don't they condemn on a more widely viewed media than what you have discovered and again these are people high in the organisation why aren't people from the hatred mosques not coming forward

 

[Slowhand]

Those 3 things I found took me about 15 seconds on google. They're not publicised because the media needs you to have someone to hate and muslims are the easy target. 60 or 70 years ago it would have been Jews.
The second bit comes back to what I said above, you want them to condemn extremism but when they do they're accused of lying. So you want them to say something but then object when they do.
Clever, really clever.

I don't object at all trev but after living next to central mosque in Birmingham for 8 years I know propaganda when I hear it

 

[dingledong]

And I do not know who these people are

 

[dingledong]

And I do not know who these people are and won't look them up as your going to come up with something a bit dopey I am sure

 

[Plonker 3]

Maybe they do condemn but as Trev pointed out the media are good at manipulating what they want you to believe.

 

[Plonker 3]

And I do not know who these people are and won't look them up as your going to come up with something a bit dopey I am sure

Not at all, they all have one common thing linking them, yet you don't seem to hear people calling for that particular group to apologise.

 

[dingledong]

So all the people killed in the name of God . What religious group did they belong which church did they go to

 

[trev]

Have I said they are lieing I said they should stand up and condemn and in daily newspapers etc etc
So again not reading what I am saying and changing the facts where did I say living
Why don't they condemn on a more widely viewed media than what you have discovered and again these are people high in the organisation why aren't people from the hatred mosques not coming forward

For starters, that one wasn't directed at you however, the links I posted up clearly show muslims condemning extremism.
It wasn't you who mentioned the lying thing so it wasn't you I was pulling about it.
The reason it's not publicised more widely is because, as I said earlier, the media needs you to have someone to hate and it's really easy to provide it. All you need is one bunch of nutters to do something and you can tar millions of people with the same brush for years.

 

[Plonker 3]

So all the people killed in the name of God . What religious group did they belong which church did they go to

Just Christians, yet there hasn't a shouting that all Christian churches should apologise for their behaviour. Yet those people merely took a extreme view of Christianity.

 

[dingledong]

Or were they just random nutcases
The bombers aren't random nutcases they are organised they have people supplying them bombs money and arms not loners who hear voices

 

[trev]

So all the people killed in the name of God . What religious group did they belong which church did they go to

Try googling the names of the people who Dillb posted up a bit back.
Peter Sutcliffe killed because he had god in his head telling him to do it.

 

[dingledong]

What religion were they there are many kinds of Christians

 

[dingledong]

They were just random killers not organized and backed by one religion

 

[Slowhand]

For starters, that one wasn't directed at you however, the links I posted up clearly show muslims condemning extremism.
It wasn't you who mentioned the lying thing so it wasn't you I was pulling about it.
The reason it's not publicised more widely is because, as I said earlier, the media needs you to have someone to hate and it's really easy to provide it. All you need is one bunch of nutters to do something and you can tar millions of people with the same brush for years.

I'm not tarring everyone with the same brush and I'm not speaking about the media, I'm talking about personal experience having lived in a predominantly islamist area for years.

 

[trev]

Or were they just random nutcases
The bombers aren't random nutcases they are organised they have people supplying them bombs money and arms not loners who hear voices

Have you got any idea how easy it is to make something that will go bang and cause a lot of damage?
You don't need a supplier, you can get the ingredients from B&Q and your local petrol station

 

[Plonker 3]

Or were they just random nutcases
The bombers aren't random nutcases they are organised they have people supplying them bombs money and arms not loners who hear voices

Why is it different, there is a big list of people with them beliefs they are just a select few. Killing in the name of religion is them same regardless of which church they go to surely or do only Muslims do that?

 

[dingledong]

And quickly reading up they are nuts Muslim killers are not

 

[Plonker 3]

The bombers aren't random nutcases they are organised they have people supplying them bombs money and arms not loners who hear voices

Thats every army in the world you have just described there.

 

[trev]

I'm not tarring everyone with the same brush and I'm not speaking about the media, I'm talking about personal experience having lived in a predominantly islamist area for years.

Yes you are tarring them all with the same brush.

 

[Plonker 3]

And quickly reading up they are nuts Muslim killers are not

you need to read a different newspaper than the daily mail.

 

[Slowhand]

Yes you are tarring them all with the same brush.

How? Where did l do that?

 

[trev]

How? Where did l do that?

The taquia thing.

 

[dingledong]

Have you got any idea how easy it is to make something that will go bang and cause a lot of damage?
You don't need a supplier, you can get the ingredients from B&Q and your local petrol station

You know these people are organised you know these people are turned by there imams
So 9/11 was some geezers coming out of b and q please stop being silly
And the train thing over here they were just independent nuts ,not organized not filmed going to the station's days before
The people dillb said were random unorganized loners no plans no backing

 

[dingledong]

Thats every army in the world you have just described there.

Armies declare war don't usually just kill civilians

 

[dingledong]

you need to read a different newspaper than the daily mail.

I think you don't read at all

 

[dingledong]

Sorry I have to work tomorrow and I need my beauty sleep

 

[Slowhand]

The taquia thing.

The taquia thing, that says they're allowed to do it without recourse. It doesn't say they all do it.
I have good muslim friends who will tell you the same. One of these friends is from the Yemen and he told me that's where the saying Lying Arab came from. That doesn't mean he does it but he recognises the fact that it happens.

 

[dingledong]

They were just random killers not organized and backed by one religion

 

[Pete999]

In case it hasn't been mentioned yet, the reason servicemen/women cant wear uniform in Selly Oak is that until recently it was a military hospital and the more able casualties went out for exercise/pub etc and were attacked by the permenently offended who didn't want them in Afghanistan.
I had to take my missus there a few years ago and I was attacked in the reception by a Somali who didn't think my missus should have a seat and he should have to stand. Within seconds 2 of the biggest sailors I've ever seen " subdued " him.

With a baseball bat I hope

 

[trev]

You know these people are organised you know these people are turned by there imams
So 9/11 was some geezers coming out of b and q please stop being silly
And the train thing over here they were just independent nuts ,not organized not filmed going to the station's days before
The people dillb said were random unorganized loners no plans no backing

You're trying to twist my words but I have to say you're failing miserably.
SOME muslims are radicalised in exactly the same way as Timothy Mcveigh was radicalised in the US. SOME of them are even radicalised by Imams.
We clear so far?
Of course 9/11 was not some blokes coming out of B&Q, it was a well organised, well financed and well executed terrorist act. However, outside of a few crazy people like Hamze, Qatada, a little bit of digging reveals a lot of condemnation by muslims in this country. So why should we blame all of them for the acts of a few dozen maniacs?
The 7/7 bombings pretty much were a bunch of blokes coming out of B&Q, it was planned and executed by a bunch of people who had been radicalised by what they saw on the internet. Once again, maniacs aside, the cast majority of muslims condemned it.
I cannot understand why there are these idiotic calls for all muslims to condemn the actions of a few crazies among them after all, as I said earlier, how many doctors felt obliged to apologise and distance themselves from Harold Shipman.
There are crazy people in all walks of life.