Adding an extra light fitting and switch

[brock flanders]

Hi Guys and you advise.

Im adding an additional light fitting and switch to a new downstairs toilet.

Can you tell me if this work needs to be certified and if so where it states that this needs to be certified as im struggling to fine a source for this information.

I have read official goverment guidlines that state for small minor alterations, nothing is required, then on the other hand some say a cirtifate is required.

All im doing is adding a couple of wires.

Cheers

 

[Octopus]

I agree

 

[shagbite]

hello ned. have a look in bs7671 - it has a wealth of info'. failing that, get a spark in.

 

[telectrix]

it does not have to be notified to BC, but a MWC should be completed for the alteration to the circuit. for what it will cost, employ a sparks to do the job.

 

[brock flanders]

Ned ?????????

Would love to get a spark in it if was free but i cant get my head round paying for somebody to turn up and charge for inspecting two wires coming off a light fitting the two going to a switch.

 

[brock flanders]

Sparks charge the earth teletrix. i just cant believe something so simple would need to be checked.
sounds like rip-off Britain again.

 

[telectrix]

so, how will you test the circuit to make sure it's safe? switch on and hope it's OK?

 

[Sintra]

Probably cost less than £100.00 quid to do the complete job and test. Not exactly expensive.

 

[LlandrilloSpark]

This thread should be binned

 

[wade88]

Sparks charge the earth teletrix. i just cant believe something so simple would need to be checked.
sounds like rip-off Britain again.

And what do you do for work Ned? I suppose your a charity worker who wonders the down trodden streets handing out hot dogs and free hand shakes, folding old newspapers into rain hats for those less fortunate. Or are you just one of those guys who thinks Britain owes you a favour and you should be getting something for nothing?

Calling in a professional, to do a safe, legitimate job, on a subject you clearly know very little about, to prevent the posibility of accidental death/fire as a result of ignorant attempts at a profession you know nothing about, hardly strikes me as a rip off, in fact i feel fortunate that we live in a country where there are professional resources available, at lets face it lads, a pittance to what we should be getting paid - that are available to come and do these things for those who know no better.

Count your lucky stars you dont live in the darkest corner of the Congo pal, youd be running your new bog switch of dynamo generator you would be peddling whilst taking a dump.

 

[brock flanders]

I would turn the power back on and see if the light comes on.
As a served multiskilled engineer and now as a design engineer working for ESA. with 17 years experence of designing wiring looms PCB's and a vast array of other things, im sure it will be ok.

Sorry to rant but it just seems simple alteration questions always get answered with get a spark in to a a couple of wirs for £120 when it would cost me about £5 to do it myself.

Again appologies for the rant.

 

[simpson93]

Ned ?????????

i do believe it was a joke with refrence too the simpsons.

 

[wade88]

No cert necessary though so youd be ok

 

[Guest111]

just out of interest may I enquire what the plumber charged you just for throwing a few pipes in?

 

[simpson93]

I would turn the power back on and see if the light comes on.
As a served multiskilled engineer and now as a design engineer working for ESA. with 17 years experence of designing wiring looms PCB's and a vast array of other things, im sure it will be ok.

Sorry to rant but it just seems simple alteration questions always get answered with get a spark in to a a couple of wirs for £120 when it would cost me about £5 to do it myself.

Again appologies for the rant.

i do believe this would be breaking the part p regulation.

 

[Deleted member 9648]

Hi Guys and you advise.

Im adding an additional light fitting and switch to a new downstairs toilet.

Can you tell me if this work needs to be certified and if so where it states that this needs to be certified as im struggling to fine a source for this information.

I have read official goverment guidlines that state for small minor alterations, nothing is required, then on the other hand some say a cirtifate is required.

All im doing is adding a couple of wires.

Cheers

If you are competant to do the work go ahead....As long as it's not a new circuit or within a bathroom or kitchen no requirement to notiify B/C. Part P does require that all installation work in domestic situations must comply with Bs 7671. This means earthing,bonding and circuit protection for your addition must comply with Bs 7671,and it should be tested in accordance with the requirements of 7671....Your call.....I'm not one of the posters on this forum who think only an electrician is capable of carrying out minor installs in domestics,but only you REALLY know if you are capable of doing it safely.

 

[telectrix]

british gas will charge you £80+VAT per hour labour just to connect that bit of copper pipe to your gas fire. the average self-employed spark charges £20 - £30 per hour. obviously yhou're going to do ther gas work yourself as the saving is much greater.

 

[Guest111]

I would turn the power back on and see if the light comes on.
As a served multiskilled engineer and now as a design engineer working for ESA. with 17 years experence of designing wiring looms PCB's and a vast array of other things, im sure it will be ok.

Sorry to rant but it just seems simple alteration questions always get answered with get a spark in to a a couple of wirs for £120 when it would cost me about £5 to do it myself.

Again appologies for the rant.

As a qualified vet I can understand your feelings however many people come on here pretending to be qualified and we do not know if they are,which could land one of us in trouble should you be injured carrying out the work.Lets be honest if the job was so easy you would already know what to do. best wishes Phil.

 

[LlandrilloSpark]

No cert necessary though so youd be ok

Minor works cert definitely every time for work like this.....your adding cable

 

[markc123]

We're seeing more and more threads like this aren't we, they're all similar - some new member with massive balls freely admitting they're gonna do the job themselves to an electricians forum....there either all wind-up merchants, or incredibly stupid.

Aye minor works for addition to a circuit, but we all know 99& of sparks would do this for £50quid cash in hand no questions asked lol

 

[marc_v33]

its alright lads the holidaysare closing to an end and all the diyers wil have something else ton worry about!!! well atleast until easter anyways

 

[markc123]

...but that means are holidays are also close to an end and the fact we have to socialise with builders and plumbers again and its making me feel sick....pass me the vodka

 

[Deleted member 9648]

We're seeing more and more threads like this aren't we, they're all similar - some new member with massive balls freely admitting they're gonna do the job themselves to an electricians forum....there either all wind-up merchants, or incredibly stupid.

Aye minor works for addition to a circuit, but we all know 99& of sparks would do this for £50quid cash in hand no questions asked lol

Cant believe this post....it's adding an additional light FFS,and he's not asking how to do it,just if it needs notifying.....only one person on here who thinks he's large in the balls department and it's not the OP.

 

[markc123]

Wirepuller.............have you read the rest of his comments?

You honestly think he's not going to be doing it himself? yeah ok then

 

[LlandrilloSpark]

Whhoooooo??????

 

[Deleted member 9648]

Wirepuller.............have you read the rest of his comments?

You honestly think he's not going to be doing it himself? yeah ok then

I KNOW he's doing it himself!....thats the point,WHY SHOULDNT HE DO IT HIMSELF....AND WHY DOES HE REQUIRE OVERSIZED BALLS TO WIRE ONE LIGHT?

 

[markc123]

I KNOW he's doing himself!....thats the point,WHY SHOULDNT HE DO IT HIMSELF....!

The pont is...he's not qualified?

I know sweet FA about Gas, so when we've had our new gas fire's installed before christmas i got the gas-man, didn't do it myself. So why should it be different for electrics?

I've just read above that you're not the type of electrician that thinks people shouldn't do their own electrics if they feel they're competent...you honestly can't be for real. Why not just pay £50 get a sparks to do the job properly and safely.

 

[paul wannell]

what i wanna know is how big is this toilet that it needs an extra switch? is it an extra switch needs mwc or replacing fitting and switch doesnt need cert

 

[markc123]

paul technically it still needs a minor works if you're even changing the fitting or switch but no body bothers

 

[PEG]

Just a hedgehog in the sleeping bag...but the gas fitter at the refurb work in Irlam was qualified,certified and authorised yet we heard THAT boom from 4 miles down the road.Notice the word missing from the above list? Competant. Anyway,i'm a time served qualified gynocologist yet you never hear me whinge when others roll their sleeves up and have a go...

 

[markc123]

Can see this thread is starting to turn abit heated, PEG...i wasn't actually whiniging i was just stating the point at first that theres so many chancers on here now

 

[Deleted member 9648]

The pont is...he's not qualified?

I know sweet FA about Gas, so when we've had our new gas fire's installed before christmas i got the gas-man, didn't do it myself. So why should it be different for electrics?

I've just read above that you're not the type of electrician that thinks people shouldn't do their own electrics if they feel they're competent...you honestly can't be for real. Why not just pay £50 get a sparks to do the job properly and safely.

Quite frankly I've never heard such rubbish. What is so hard about adding a single light to an existing point?...I'll wager at some point in your history you have changed the brakes on your car...or undertaken some similar skilled task normally carried out by another trade,and yet you wont accept that anyone not in the trade can carry out a simple electrical job if they are competant.
Before you ask I do know the risks...I have attended the immediate aftermath of a DIY electrics death,and given evidence at the subsequent inquest. But I will defend for ever the right for anyone to carry out electrical work WITHIN THE LAW in their own homes if they so wish,just as I will defend for ever the right for me and you to replace the brakes on our cars to save a few quid.....'Bout time you dropped the ego trip.

 

[markc123]

Quite frankly I've never heard such rubbish. What is so hard about adding a single light to an existing point?...I'll wager at some point in your history you have changed the brakes on your car...or undertaken some similar skilled task normally carried out by another trade,and yet you wont accept that anyone not in the trade can carry out a simple electrical job if they are competant.
Before you ask I do know the risks...I have attended the immediate aftermath of a DIY electrics death,and given evidence at the subsequent inquest. But I will defend for ever the right for anyone to carry out electrical work WITHIN THE LAW in their own homes if they so wish,just as I will defend for ever the right for me and you to replace the brakes on our cars to save a few quid.....'Bout time you dropped the ego trip.

Sigh, you're gonna run yourself outta work wirepuller if you keep advising people to do their own electrics...lights can be wired different ways, then the customer rings you up because its not switching on or off...just get the job done properly in the first place!

If you're changing a plug, or even a faceplate for a light switch / socket if you're completley sure that its dead then fine diy, if it involves wiring don't. Sorry to hear that you've seen a diy'er death.

And to be fair, if my vans got a problem i just send it to the garage - yes we're in an economic downturn but i still don't find it acceptable to cut corners. Building a shelf isn't like medalling with gas or electrics. I honestly can't see your reasoning to think that its actually acceptable wirepuller, i just cant. It all goes on and theres nothing we can do to stop it granted, but to promote it IMO i think is wrong.

 

[paul wannell]

mark gonna bow to your greater knowledge but if not altering or adding to an excisting circuit why would it need mwc?

 

[markc123]

mark gonna bow to your greater knowledge but if not altering or adding to an excisting circuit why would it need mwc?

Read GN3 section on minor works.

Nobody does it, but technically its needed.

 

[Plonker 3]

Don't forget that the new cable that is installed might need to be RCD protected.

 

[brock flanders]

Thanks most of you guys for the answering my original question, which is all i asked for. But as always on forums you get the wanna be mouthy know it all's like Wade88 and Mark123 who know how to run a wire from A to B.
Yes im doing a bit of DIY is that a issue.
I have 17 years experience as an engineer and yes that’s a proper engineer i.e. chartered status. IMechE. I spent 4 years as an apprentice in the automotive industry and 3 years working for the Military. I now work as a research, design engineer for ESA compiling sophisticated satellite systems. So don’t tell me it’s something is cant do. Unlike Wade88 and Mark123 i unfortunately didn’t do the 3 week multiple choice questionnaire and wiring a plug test and checking with a multi-meter test. No i spent 11 years part time at college and university to get my qualifications. You think you know about all things electrical. Tell me what cross torque voltage creepage is. I don’t think so.

So like i said, all im doing is the most simplest bit of work ive ever carried out. Adding 4 wires, a switch and a light fitting. Sorry to Mark123 and Wade88 if this is classed as a big job to you. But i know you have to justify why you charge what you do and take more than a week to do it.


Nuff said

Even thou you still will insist of slagging people off who didnt do the 3 week multiple choice course to make them certified

 

[shagbite]

you sound very knowledgable, but the fact that you're on here asking questions, suggests you don't know what you're doing.

 

[simpson93]

you sound very knowledgable, but the fact that you're on here asking questions, suggests you don't know what you're doing.

he was just asking a legal question about regulations, doesnt mean he cant wire a light.

 

[brock flanders]

Just wanted to ask if i needed to get the work tested and certified. As an easy option, rather than paging through lots of regulatory documnets to get the right answer. carrying out the work is a doddle.
thought somebody on here might be of some use, which some have been others are just being the usual muppets that they are.

 

[Plonker 3]

Right Mr "know it all"

We work to BS7671:2008 amendment 1 2011 at present.

So as long as your work complies with the following regs it will be fine to do

Chapter 13
411.3.1.2
Table 41.1
411.3.2
One of the following tables 41.2,41.3 or 41.4
maybe section 411.5
Section 41.2
434.5
Probably 514.1.1
514.1.2
514.1.3
514.4.2
scetion 522
Section 531
Section 533
537.5
Read all of chapter 54
Section 559
Chapter 61
Chapter 63
Appendices 3,4,6,7,12.

Once you have satisified all the above what you are doing will be fine. Happy to help

 

[MDJ]

Thanks most of you guys for the answering my original question, which is all i asked for. But as always on forums you get the wanna be mouthy know it all's like Wade88 and Mark123 who know how to run a wire from A to B.
Yes im doing a bit of DIY is that a issue.
I have 17 years experience as an engineer and yes that’s a proper engineer i.e. chartered status. IMechE. I spent 4 years as an apprentice in the automotive industry and 3 years working for the Military. I now work as a research, design engineer for ESA compiling sophisticated satellite systems. So don’t tell me it’s something is cant do. Unlike Wade88 and Mark123 i unfortunately didn’t do the 3 week multiple choice questionnaire and wiring a plug test and checking with a multi-meter test. No i spent 11 years part time at college and university to get my qualifications. You think you know about all things electrical. Tell me what cross torque voltage creepage is. I don’t think so.

So like i said, all im doing is the most simplest bit of work ive ever carried out. Adding 4 wires, a switch and a light fitting. Sorry to Mark123 and Wade88 if this is classed as a big job to you. But i know you have to justify why you charge what you do and take more than a week to do it.


Nuff said

Even thou you still will insist of slagging people off who didnt do the 3 week multiple choice course to make them certified

If it is so easy why come here asking, your 17 years experience doesn't impress me, and you won't need to change the light using a jack as you would changing a tyre, however having said this I tend to agree with wirepuller on this occassion that this Job is easy enough for most, What you would have got from me was the job done right and a certificate and 12 month warrenty plus the works guarenteed through my insurance and all for 50-60 quid I suspect, anyhow, do the job yourself and just be careful, Happy new year.

 

[paul wannell]

what 3 week multiple choice test is this. wish someone told me. i could have saved loads of time and effort and money etc etc.
seriously though a few people getting upset on here, deep breath and calm.
brock you cant hold it against people advising you to get the qualified people in to do the job, after all its their industry and livelyhood they need to look after.


peace everyone.

 

[Plonker 3]

Just wanted to ask if i needed to get the work tested and certified. As an easy option, rather than paging through lots of regulatory documnets to get the right answer. carrying out the work is a doddle.
thought somebody on here might be of some use, which some have been others are just being the usual muppets that they are.

We pay over £70 for the BGB, I spent 4 days at college at my own expense losing £200 a day. The course cost over £200 thats over £1000 it cost me and you want all the information for free!!! Jog on.

 

[wade88]

I apologise Brock for being a little facetious.

I have no problem as wirepuller has mentioned with people doing their own DIY. In fact, and im sorry Mark as i completely agree with your point of view also, i cant see the problem with it. People own their own homes, why should they not alter it as they see fit. I miss understood your original post as being some numpty who was just trying to blag some advice on how to wire a switch in, which obviously isnt a good idea if you have no idea what your doing, and then further mocking the industry by suggesting its a rip off to have the work done professionally.

But if your such an over qualified smart arse who apparently is next in line to ride a satellite into space along with 3 gerbils and a autistic reindeer, why are you on this forum asking if you can wire your switch in without getting slapped on the wrist? Surely you would have just done it or sensibly rang your LABC..... OR, for fear of being reminded how incredibly intelligent you are, didnt you just buy a copy of the regs or GN3 and just carry on being a clever clogs in peace

 

[shagbite]

he was just asking a legal question about regulations, doesnt mean he cant wire a light.

there's more to it than the legal question that was being queried. what about loading of the circuit, provision of rcd's + testing & certification for the job? shouldn't these things be accounted for?

 

[Plonker 3]

So like i said, all im doing is the most simplest bit of work ive ever carried out. Adding 4 wires, a switch and a light fitting. .

If it thats easy do you have to ask someone how to do everthing?

And breath in, breath out breath in, breath out ,breath in, breath out ,breath in, breath out ,breath in, breath out, breath in, breath out

 

[markc123]

Thanks most of you guys for the answering my original question, which is all i asked for. But as always on forums you get the wanna be mouthy know it all's like Wade88 and Mark123 who know how to run a wire from A to B.
Yes im doing a bit of DIY is that a issue.
I have 17 years experience as an engineer and yes that’s a proper engineer i.e. chartered status. IMechE. I spent 4 years as an apprentice in the automotive industry and 3 years working for the Military. I now work as a research, design engineer for ESA compiling sophisticated satellite systems. So don’t tell me it’s something is cant do. Unlike Wade88 and Mark123 i unfortunately didn’t do the 3 week multiple choice questionnaire and wiring a plug test and checking with a multi-meter test. No i spent 11 years part time at college and university to get my qualifications. You think you know about all things electrical. Tell me what cross torque voltage creepage is. I don’t think so.

So like i said, all im doing is the most simplest bit of work ive ever carried out. Adding 4 wires, a switch and a light fitting. Sorry to Mark123 and Wade88 if this is classed as a big job to you. But i know you have to justify why you charge what you do and take more than a week to do it.


Nuff said

Even thou you still will insist of slagging people off who didnt do the 3 week multiple choice course to make them certified

Im a time served spark actually, so before you go insulting people's intelligence get your facts correct. If you knew what you were doing, and you were as clever as you're making out...why an earth are you asking such a basic question on an electricians forum?

 

[Deleted member 9648]

Sigh, you're gonna run yourself outta work wirepuller if you keep advising people to do their own electrics...lights can be wired different ways, then the customer rings you up because its not switching on or off...just get the job done properly in the first place!

If you're changing a plug, or even a faceplate for a light switch / socket if you're completley sure that its dead then fine diy, if it involves wiring don't. Sorry to hear that you've seen a diy'er death.

And to be fair, if my vans got a problem i just send it to the garage - yes we're in an economic downturn but i still don't find it acceptable to cut corners. Building a shelf isn't like medalling with gas or electrics. I honestly can't see your reasoning to think that its actually acceptable wirepuller, i just cant. It all goes on and theres nothing we can do to stop it granted, but to promote it IMO i think is wrong.

Fair enough....Lets just agree to disagree

 

[Deleted member 9648]

Im a time served spark actually, so before you go insulting people's intelligence get your facts correct. If you knew what you were doing, and you were as clever as you're making out...why an earth are you asking such a basic question on an electricians forum?

Hi Guys and you advise.

Im adding an additional light fitting and switch to a new downstairs toilet.

Can you tell me if this work needs to be certified and if so where it states that this needs to be certified as im struggling to fine a source for this information.

I have read official goverment guidlines that state for small minor alterations, nothing is required, then on the other hand some say a cirtifate is required.

All im doing is adding a couple of wires.

Cheers

It's not a basic question....it would be if he was asking how to do it....but he's not,like most of Joepublic he's completely confused by the dogs dinner that is part P.