Amendment 3 is getting closer- find out about Risk Assessment changes

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Discuss Amendment 3 is getting closer- find out about Risk Assessment changes in the UK Electrical Forum area at ElectriciansForums.net

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AmtechGroup

The BS 7671:2008 Amendment 3 changes are coming ever closer. We are producing a range of white papers highlighting the main changes affecting electrical contractors and designers. Our latest concentrates on Risk Assessments for the Omission of RCDs for Socket outlets.

Amendment 3 proposes changes to the regulations governing the additional protection by means of an RCD for socket outlets whose ratings do not exceed 20A. Under the proposed changes, if the designer decides that RCD protection is not required, he then must provide and document his reasons for their omission. This should be provided in the form of a Risk Assessment and appended to the appropriate Electrical Installation Certificate.

You can download our free white paper for full information and sample Risk Assessment forms.
Download here - Risk Assessments for the Omission of RCDs for Socket Outlets :: Amtech Group
 
All positive feedback about the amendment then..... :)
 
Im curious..... Besides being ripped off because we now have to buy another book (well work does) what do people have against the change?
Anyone think its a good thing... (people who are financially motivated by the change may not reply to this)?
 
As far as I can tell the changes are so small they are hardly necessary.

Maybe the IET should spend the money on sending people out to the coal face to catch all the trade bodgers ignoring ALL the BS regs and building regs!
 
Take the production of BS7671 out of the hands of the ITE altogether and pass it over to CIBSE. Let the ITE concentrate on the power and it's associated industries, where they have always been far more at home, than the building services side of things!!
 
just typical scouse/geordie banter. them geordies just can't come to terms with not being able to climb hadrians wall, so they nicked all thew stones instead.
 
telectrix said:
just typical scouse/geordie banter. them geordies just can't come to terms with not being able to climb hadrians wall, so they nicked all thew stones instead.
Click to expand...

I aint getting into some ethnic war on these fair shores enough of them shenanigans going on overseas, we'll be having passport control next
 
Getting serious for a minute, if I'm reading that document correctly, and knowing me there may be something I'm missing, it sounds to me as if they are saying a 32 Amp RFC should be RCD protected, yet if you put a 20Amp radial with socket outlets on it and you don't want to fit an RCD you need a RA am I right? or have I drunk to much of the red stuff and gone brain dead, serious answer please Tel
 
Geordie Spark said:
Waddya mean "Geordie git must cement mantle fell in mersey" ???? :whatchutalkingabout:confused:
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bloody google translate. original said " geordie git needs a cement overcoa t& dropping into the mersey. goddamn germans. no sense of humour. :54:
 
dementia pills are on the sideboard. next to your teeth in the tumbler. ( no, not the bourbon tumbler, the one next to it ).
 
Pete999 said:
Getting serious for a minute, if I'm reading that document correctly, and knowing me there may be something I'm missing, it sounds to me as if they are saying a 32 Amp RFC should be RCD protected, yet if you put a 20Amp radial with socket outlets on it and you don't want to fit an RCD you need a RA am I right? or have I drunk to much of the red stuff and gone brain dead, serious answer please Tel
Click to expand...

In any situation where an RCD is required for a socket circuit if you have a documented risk assessment showing it not required then the RCD may be omitted is the proposal.
It just means there will be generic RA forms produced that state "this circuit has been competently assessed and due to the nature of the use of the socket outlets an RCD is not required" and attached to the EIC.

PART 4
PROTECTION FOR SAFETY
CHAPTER 41
PROTECTION AGAINST ELECTRIC SHOCK
411 PROTECTIVE MEASURE: AUTOMATIC DISCONNECTION OF SUPPLY
411.3 Requirements for fault protection
411.3.3 Additional protection
In a.c. systems. additional protection by means of an RCD in accordance with Regulation 415.1 shall be provided for:
(i) socket-outlets with a rated current not exceeding 20A and
(ii) mobile equipment with a current rating not exceeding 32 A for use outdoors.
An exception to (i) is permitted
(a) for a specific labelled or otherwise suitably identified socket-outlet provided for connection of a particular item of equipment, or
(b) where a documented risk assessment determines that the RCD protection is not necessary.
NOTE 1: See also Regulations 314.1(iv) and 531.2.4 concerning the avoidance of unwanted tripping.
NOTE 2: The requirements of Regulation 411.3.3.; do not apply to FELV systems according to Regulation 411.7 or reduced low voltage systems according to Regulation 411.8.
 
problem arises if the cable/s to said sockets are buried <50mm deep. the sockets mught not require RCD but the cable will ( unless other forms of protection are used).
 
telectrix said:
problem arises if the cable/s to said sockets are buried <50mm deep. the sockets mught not require RCD but the cable will ( unless other forms of protection are used).
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Yes Tel I was trying to put words to that thought, this new amendment seems to contradict it's self, on one hand it's sockets rated at 20amps or less they don't need RCD coverage provided there is a risk assessment covering the reason, but you're right if the cable is less that 50mm buried and not protected it needs RCD coverage, it being the cable, I see trouble ahead.
 
Pete999 said:
Yes Tel I was trying to put words to that thought, this new amendment seems to contradict it's self, on one hand it's sockets rated at 20amps or less they don't need RCD coverage provided there is a risk assessment covering the reason, but you're right if the cable is less that 50mm buried and not protected it needs RCD coverage, it being the cable, I see trouble ahead.
Click to expand...

My crystal ball sees lots of surface trunking ahead!
 
I'm not understanding any confusion over this reg change.
Everything is exactly the same as before except where you could previously exempt a socket from RCD protection for a "skilled or instructed person" just by saying so, you now will just have to provide a piece of paper saying the same thing. That's it. All the rules regarding RCD protection of sockets and cables remain unchanged.
 
Andy78 said:
True, very true. Seems they are always rewording things to clarify muddy issues that could have been written better in the first place.
Click to expand...

Aye, they've never heard the old saying; "Do it right, do it once" or whatever it is. Bloody muppets. Have nowt to do with them.
 
whats one of them RDC things. is it summat to do with rugby?
 
Best way round just fit RCD protection to everything & then don't have to bother with Ra, I personally fit RCBO's to nearly all boards I change.
 
I think the RA is a good idea that clears things up. Before it was open to interpretation now it is black or white. No written RA then RCD protection is required. No arguments from the client.
 

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