Neutrals at switches

[peterb2428]

As opposed to a terminal block at the ceiling? Great logic luv

If adding another light would you need to take a feed from the switch???????

 

[Des 56]

Ah Ah I like this thread

Its been stated 3-plate is standard/good practice and was always taught
When may ask did the "good" practice of looping in at the lights begin ?

It certainly was not standard practice in the 60s

Standard practice in a domestic in the 60s was a junction box under the floor boards with the supply live and neutral,switch cables and one cable at the light,neutrals may have been the exception with a single slung around the roses to loop those lights
Granted the neutrals were not at the switch,but the method doesn't need considering these days because it was old hat


I used to wire and fit star delta starters that had a handle on them, for the user to swing over when they thought the speed was just right,they are no longer used, because, it was a practice that would be out of step with other and better methods available since
I thought I'd stick that in just in case I suddenly became a Domestic installer

Times change,wiring methods sometimes also need to change, and us older lot need to put aside the attitude of this is how we did it,so that is the way it should always be done
Its like I said earlier,there is no correct method,we are supposed to design simple and even complex circuits to the best methods available, whatever opinions we may be tied to

I am staying "neutral" because there has not yet been one post that gives an electrical reason why it should not be done,rather the 3-plate method seems to be taking a bit of a bashing and the switch method has shown to have more advantages

 

[aptsys]

I was taught that wiring accessory points should not be used as joint boxes, probably the same as you were. And that is the very point!!! They are Not joint boxes and were never designed to be so either.

Again, why is it better to stuff the looped lives into a terminal block in the ceiling than at the switch? 'Wiring accessory points' are indeed to be used as 'joint boxes' otherwise how would you connect the accessory to the wires?

 

[morph]

If adding another light would you need to take a feed from the switch???????

if it is to be switched independantly then yes
but if the feed was in the ceiling loop or dodgy j/b then you would still need to chase the wall out to do a new switch , so its 6 of one and half a dozen of the other

 

[topquark]

That's why we'll all be using wireless switching soon

 

[IQ Electrical]

I take it it's a 'slow news day' on the forum if this thread is anything to go by!

I'd like to show the quality of work on many of my PIR's where a neutral at a light switch would be treated with the attention and code that it deserves (none).

Was there a reference earlier questioning the quality of the apprenticeship served because of someone's willing to introduce a neutral to a switch position?

I've heard it all now and if you think sticking to a pointless clause of 1960's specifications is engineering free thinking then I'm out of touch!

Loop your neutral according to the characteristics of your light fittings rather than 'how we did it in the good old day's!'

 

[peterb2428]

But surely if the switches have been plastered in then you would need to chase two sockets? but if feed was taken from ceiling not the same prob?

 

[aptsys]

If adding another light would you need to take a feed from the switch???????

If adding another light, you already have a feed at the switch, so you'd just need one more cable to your new light. Otherwise you'd need to take a new feed from another light, and another cable to a switch.

But anyway, I'm not saying loop in at the switch is the ONLY way to do things. You choose which is most appropriate while designing the circuit.

 

[Phil]

That's why we'll all be using wireless switching soon

i already am. wireless switching and wireless passive infrareds outside. fantastic bit of kit and not too expensive

 

[aptsys]

But surely if the switches have been plastered in then you would need to chase two sockets? but if feed was taken from ceiling not the same prob?

Who mentioned sockets?!

 

[Guest 004]

@E54 with you all the way

 

[peterb2428]

switch sockets/plates/backbox/whatever

 

[Des 56]

i already am. wireless switching and wireless pir`s outside. fantastic bit of kit and not too expensive

If its changing again before the present standard is sorted,I have had enough,I will stay with the present standard

What is the present standard by the way

 

[ezzzekiel]

a lot of people were against penecillin when first introduced

 

[Phil]

If its changing again before the present standard is sorted,I have had enough,I will stay with the present standard

What is the present standard by the way

i have just read my post back wireless "PIR`S" sounds like a drive by periodic. im off to edit my post to wireless passive infrared

 

[IQ Electrical]

a lot of people were against penecillin when first introduced

I'm firmly against penicillin in switch boxes.

 

[Phil]

I'm firmly against penicillin in switch boxes.

so am i at nearly 8 quid a perscription

 

[davelerave]

don't work in UK -but all dom work i do is done that way

you won't do it for laziness anyhow as it's more copper and work

 

[peterb2428]

so am i at nearly 8 quid a perscription

Me too

 

[Electricalserv]

Ive just finished my apprenticeship. The boss taught me too do it this way as he said it was easier than risking falling off a ladder 6ft up, i did question whether it was bad practice, he said no. I find myself doing the final connections at the switch is better than leaving a junction box up above, where it could then be a pain in the --- for the next bloke coming in?

Risk falling of a ladder what about takeing a Zs reading....Hold on lets just do the calculation Zs= Ze + R1 + R2 like the Niceic say to do.

I've never seen this and never ever been taught to this. Il also never teach anyone to do it.