PIR coding

[Deleted member 26818]

Different ways of interpreting the term 'readily accessible', how odd.
To my mind, something is 'readily accessible', if it can be accessed without the use of a key, tool or access equipment.
Access equipment being ladders, MEWPs, helicopters, etc.

 

[Dave OCD]

To be on the safe side just remove the fitting and re-mount it on a piece of timber bigger than the base of the fitting with a hole drilled through it only just big enough for the supply cable.

 

[ruston]

To be on the safe side just remove the fitting and re-mount it on a piece of timber bigger than the base of the fitting with a hole drilled through it only just big enough for the supply cable.

You are right , it needs sorting as.

Quote the OP---

"Meaning due to the size of the fitting its possible for someone to put there hand above the
fitting and go into the connection behind..

 

[davesparks]

If it's the kind of fitting im thinking it is then an oversize conduit box lid between the bracket and the beam can work to cover the gaps

 

[andyb]

Interesting thread.

How would you code a pendant in a room then?

 

[Dave OCD]

Yeah something like that would do fine as well.

Edit - reply to Davesparks' post.

 

[davesparks]

Interesting thread.

How would you code a pendant in a room then?

I don't follow, what is the problem?

 

[Dave OCD]

Interesting thread.

How would you code a pendant in a room then?

You can't put your hand into the top of a fitting that's fixed tight to a ceiling.

 

[andyb]

I don't follow, what is the problem?

No problem Dave, it's puzzled me for a while now how normal lamp holders are still allowed.
Often accessible without steps, live parts accessible without the use of a tool. Just take the lamp out.
Same with table lamps.

The code question was rhetorical.

 

[ruston]

With the lamp missing? but that could apply to any fitting.

 

[andyb]

With the lamp missing? but that could apply to any fitting.

That's my point.

 

[davesparks]

No problem Dave, it's puzzled me for a while now how normal lamp holders are still allowed.
Often accessible without steps, live parts accessible without the use of a tool. Just take the lamp out.
Same with table lamps.

The code question was rhetorical.

That is basically grudgingly permitted through the historical existence of the standard.
Basically there is no simple way to get rid of them!

If you look at a more modern mains rated lampholder design like the GU10 then it's got a much better IP

 

[ruston]

That's my point.

Still no reason to install a fitting with , what I am assuming are exposed live terminals.
I see your point and have considered it before. Although some are safe.
Brass Lamp Bulb Holder with Safety Switch 10mm Bayonet Cap B22 ? Buy It Better

That's similar to the type I meant where the pins have to be compressed.

 

[Dave OCD]

It's a very good point, I suppose the difference is anyone in their right mind would expect there to be a potentially lethal voltage present within a lampholder so will avoid getting fingers too close, the other scenario is all about preventing accidental contact when the danger isn't as clearly perceived.

 

[davesparks]

Plus there can be permanent live inside the fitting that doesn't go off when the switch is turned off

 

[gutterball]

I would assume the live parts would be in some sort of connector and not likely to be able to be touched so not a shock hazard. So I would give it a 3 at the very most, and probably not code it at all. As above could you not put a disk of some sort of material over it?

 

[davesparks]

I would assume the live parts would be in some sort of connector and not likely to be able to be touched so not a shock hazard. So I would give it a 3 at the very most, and probably not code it at all. As above could you not put a disk of some sort of material over it?

Assume, some sort, not likely,

All nice definite terms to be basing a professional decision and safety report on!

 

[Flanders]

The op has still not answered my question as to why a pir is being carried out on a new install , mind you i don't think the op as returned at all, i am enjoying the debate about the lamp holder , i would go down the line that only an idiot would put their fingers in a lamp holder , but somone not thinking could be their hand inside the open part of the fitting .

 

[Lucien Nunes]

To my mind, something is 'readily accessible', if it can be accessed without the use of a key, tool or access equipment.

To mine, these don't belong in the same category. If someone uses a key or tool to detach or open something, they will be aware that whatever was previously behind / within will become exposed. OTOH if they use access equipment for some unrelated purpose like cleaning or decorating, they wouldn't anticipate suddenly being exposed to an existing but hidden electrical hazard.

Turned around, if you popped a downlighter out to change a transformer and a bunch of venomous spiders fell out onto you without warning, would you be happy with the explanation 'I keep them up there because they are only accessible from a ladder.'

 

[andyb]

Venomous spiders, code 1 or 2?