EV charging in a dwelling

[VWWM 1]

Hi
A client wants a EV type 2 charger but she lives in a end of terrace. There is a pathway in front of her house and a front garden but no driveway yet. Can she have one installed?
No Olev grant but I thought you couldn’t if they didn’t have a car driveway to stop a possible trailing lead.
thanks

 

[snowhead]

You can't trail leads acrosss a footpath, not even under a cable protector.

And if you want the Legislation this is it;
Under the Highways Act 1980, Part IX Lawful and Unlawful
Interference with Highways and Streets, it is illegal for
any person to place or run a cable or wire along or across
a public highway.

 

[VWWM 1]

You can't trail leads acrosss a footpath, not even under a cable protector.

And if you want the Legislation this is it;
Under the Highways Act 1980, Part IX Lawful and Unlawful
Interference with Highways and Streets, it is illegal for
any person to place or run a cable or wire along or across
a public highway.

Thanks
The actual road is 10 m away but there is a small grass area that has a path running along to the house and then they each have a path off that to their properties. And there is a path to her side entrance leading to the back garden.
She might have a drive in the future where the front garden is.
I can’t see it though as this public green area sits in front?
Unless she plans on driving up and every day over the area close to her house?
But it’s not at the moment an actual drive.
And you can’t have ext leads so I don’t think she can have one.

 

[marcuswareham]

I wonder if a pedestal-type charger could be installed by the roadside, with some security to not allow others to use I guess, Of course they would have to own the land or have permission from the landowner not only for where the pedestal will be but also the buried cable root,

EVs seem to be presenting some challenges be it the location of the charge point at your address (flats, houses without driveways etc) or the use of TN earths

Hopefully once most cars on the road are EVs, we will have "petrol stations" in which you can swap out you battery pack in some way for an instant full charge, or a very very quick charger that takes a similar amount of time as filling with petrol

 

[snowhead]

Some local authorities will arrange the install street side EV chargers if requested by residents.
The problem is they aren't guaranteed to be outside your house or reserved for your exclusive use.

 

[Gavin John Hyde]

If she is going to have a driveway at some point then its a case of getting power from house to drive. if the garden is hers and the pathway comes with access rights. I would look into the potential to run a suitably buried SWA cable to the garden/future drive.

 

[Soi disant]

Hopefully once most cars on the road are EVs, we will have "petrol stations" in which you can swap out you battery pack in some way for an instant full charge,

Don't hold your breath - unless they get orders of magnitude improvements in power density so that batteries get a lot lot smaller, they are always going to be packaged differently from one car to another as their shape and location is so dependent on the styling of the car, and vice-versa.

or a very very quick charger that takes a similar amount of time as filling with petrol

Again, watch you don't go blue in the face ?. A petrol/diesel pump is an approximately 35-40MW appliance. Pick any realistic figure you like for how much more efficient EVs are, even a small filling station is going to be a real challenge to replace with one that delivers electrical power at tank-filling rates.

 

[marcuswareham]

Don't hold your breath - unless they get orders of magnitude improvements in power density so that batteries get a lot lot smaller, they are always going to be packaged differently from one car to another as their shape and location is so dependent on the styling of the car, and vice-versa.

indeed, just like the tesla battery being basically the floor and it would require all the manufacturer to work together, probably wont happen

35-40MW appliance.

Wow that is alot of juice

 

[Soi disant]

Wow that is alot of juice

9.5kWh in 1l of petrol, 9.9 in 1l of diesel.

 

[Zerax]

I think we're going to see the provision of car charging as a selling point for houses/flats. Similar to having a sea view adding value.

 

[Mike Johnson]

Batteries deteriorate with age and use, swapping them at a station would be a nightmare, not viable IMO.

 

[sparksfly]

Where's Duracell in all of this ?
Back in the day, the milk floats had standard type batteries albeit they were slow. I wonder, if we ditched current fast EVs for battery milk floats, slowly get around. No speed restrictions because you can't, encourage faster transport like err..fast cyclists, tools in the back along with the odd hitch hiker...everyone would be more relaxed....and electricians would not be expected yesterday but planned in for a change..& charge customers for travelling = more happy green people.
Sorry... back to the OP

What about a boom arm attached to the houses ?????

 

[Zerax]

What about a boom arm attached to the houses ?????

Good idea... I think there'll be lots of things that we'll see over time. Anything to do with government or councils moves very verrrry.... slooooooowwwllllyy.

We still have vast housing estates being granted planning permission that have zero provision for car charging ! We still have building regs with woefully low thermal insulation levels, woefully low sound insulation levels and developers who are permitted to self certify the garbage they're building ! This has been going on for years and years and years.... And these things are the 'easy-to-fix' ones !

 

[Lister1987]

Batteries deteriorate with age and use, swapping them at a station would be a nightmare, not viable IMO.

Already being done on Japan with levels of success.

 

[Soi disant]

We still have vast housing estates being granted planning permission that have zero provision for car charging !

And yet I'm sure I read recently that at least one DNO is now installing 125A cutouts as standard for new connections to allow for EV charging.....

 

[Gavin John Hyde]

And yet I'm sure I read recently that at least one DNO is now installing 125A cutouts as standard for new connections to allow for EV charging.....

Wpd are now fitting 3 phase cutouts as standard on new installs

 

[Mike Johnson]

Already being done on Japan with levels of success.

Can we see some evidence of that?

 

[snowhead]

Can we see some evidence of that?

This is in China;

 

[Mike Johnson]

I did not see them take anything out and put anything different in, just lifted the car and put something underneath it and then lowered it again, not very convincing IMO.

 

[Lister1987]

I did not see them take anything out and put anything different in, just lifted the car and put something underneath it and then lowered it again, not very convincing IMO.

Better Place Unveils an Electric Car Battery Swap Station

Better Place unveiled its battery swap system today and said the $500,000 gadget can replace a dead battery and get you back on the road in less time than it takes to fill your gas tank. The prototype revealed in Japan is the first of what the Silicon Valley startup promises will be countless...

www.wired.com

From 2009, ultimately the company went bankrupt but the logistics were there, unfortunately for them; that uptake from manufacturers wasn't.

 

[Zerax]

I did not see them take anything out and put anything different in, just lifted the car and put something underneath it and then lowered it again, not very convincing IMO.

Mike... the battery is probably attached underneath ?

 

[Mike Johnson]

This is more convincing:

Attached underneath, you don't say.

 

[marcuswareham]

Interesting and

Wpd are now fitting 3 phase cutouts as standard on new installs

Interesting

Also good as makes effective PEN fault monitoring very easy with access to all the phases,

 

[nicebutdim]

I did not see them take anything out and put anything different in, just lifted the car and put something underneath it and then lowered it again, not very convincing IMO.

The video clearly shows removal and refitting of battery.

Not sure if you ever played spot the difference, but the carriage that slides underneath and rotates came away with a big silver coloured mass that wasn't present when it first appeared, then switched batteries and reversed the process.

 

[Mike Johnson]

The video clearly shows removal and refitting of battery.

Not sure if you ever played spot the difference, but the carriage that slides underneath and rotates came away with a big silver coloured mass that wasn't present when it first appeared, then switched batteries and reversed the process.

That was obviously when I fell asleep, notwithstanding I missed that, the viability is zero, unless all the manufacturers instal the same power system in every car, not going to happen, hence they went bankrupt, I suppose a modular battery system could work, but again only if the manufactures can agree a system, pie in the sky IMO they all think they have the best system and I doubt they would want to share their technology.

 

[snowhead]

I did not see them take anything out and put anything different in, just lifted the car and put something underneath it and then lowered it again, not very convincing IMO.

I agree about general lack of agreement between manufacturers as they each use different battery modules across their own range and all use different voltage configurations.
But as more joint development takes place and the total number of E.V cars on the road increases it could become feasable


Removal carriage moving in


Removal carriage with old battery



Replacement battery arriving

 

[Mike Johnson]

That whole video was a farce, one make of car one module, the likelihood of joint development going on between manufactures is pie in the sky, why would one manufacturer want to give away a marketing advantage to another, I think this whole EVA vehicle strategy by Governments and the Environmental lobby has a lot of people fooled, do we really feel that putting wind farms everywhere is the answer, or is it a political move to lower the objections to future nuclear power plants? ?

Oh and just as an aside why has the advertising Ombudsman allowed the term "Self charging Hybrid" when clearly they are not, they need fuel to run the engine that charges the batteries.

There is no such thing as clean energy!

 

[nicebutdim]

That was obviously when I fell asleep, notwithstanding I missed that, the viability is zero, unless all the manufacturers instal the same power system in every car, not going to happen, hence they went bankrupt, I suppose a modular battery system could work, but again only if the manufactures can agree a system, pie in the sky IMO they all think they have the best system and I doubt they would want to share their technology.

I don't think the system is remotely feasible, but simply wanted to point out that the battery was changed.

 

[Mike Johnson]

Or some blow up bag was inflated to make it look like a box that could have contained a battery, I wonder how many AA's where in it. ?

 

[nicebutdim]

There is no such thing as clean energy!

Some of the current crop of clean energy generation (and storage) results in an incredible level of pollution, but few want to talk about that.

It makes perfect sense that we should harness nature's energy in order to generate electricty, but there is a long way to go before we can even think about describing this as being anything close to 'clean'.

 

[nicebutdim]

Or some blow up bag was inflated to make it look like a box that could have contained a battery, I wonder how many AA's where in it. ?

I think most people will reach the reasonable conclusion that this manufacturer has done exactly what they claim to have done. It's not a particularly great technological advance.

 

[Mike Johnson]

I wonder how much water energy pass's through the Thames Barrier or the Seven estuary every day? ?

 

[nicebutdim]

I wonder how much water energy pass's through the Thames Barrier or the Seven estuary every day? ?

Strongford Lough has incredible tidal currents, which attracted a long running power generation trial from 2008. It was decommissioned between 2016 and 2019. I'm sure it provided a lot of useful data but, even though I've read nothing about serious environmental impact, there doesn't yet appear to be any noises about a permanent replacement.

 

[Mike Johnson]

It seems that tidal barrages are not a favoured subject, no matter how hard you look we find very little information on them, I wonder why, perhaps not enough Government Grants available.

 

[Zerax]

I wonder how much water energy pass's through the Thames Barrier or the Seven estuary every day? ?

That would make a good A level physics question ! I remember (just) the problem of working out the force on a roof when it rains...

 

[Zerax]

It seems that tidal barrages are not a favoured subject, no matter how hard you look we find very little information on them, I wonder why, perhaps not enough Government Grants available.

There's defo been alot of research into it. I knew a guy years ago that did his PhD in tidal power... he was sponsored by Rolls Royce I think... he's one of the countries top experts on the subject... I'll see if I still have his contact details to ask him.