First electric shock

[Chrisuk]

Some of the regulars will know I'm in training...slightly confused...all day today I've been sleeving the cpc because none at all had any on and putting connector blocks in choc blocks..15mins before leaving I have my head above the ceiling...power on since where we are working are open and they don't want a third of the store in darkness from killing the mcb.

Had the connector block between finger and thumb..carefully putting it the choc block when I heard it cracking..was tightening the screws when I got a belt.

So I'm thinking could it arc...I didn't see anything...just felt it.....or Is it more likely I just had a brain fart and my thumb touched some exposed conductor?

I
Least I know the rcd kicks in fast

 

[Pete999]

Pardon, could you be a little clearer in your description of what happened, your post, it's a little disjointed:shocked:

 

[Silly Sausage]

I think it's slightly fried his brain!

 

[telectrix]

welcome to the real world of sparking. you ain't a spark till you've had a tingle or two.

 

[Chrisuk]

Haha edited it

Was more Swype messing me up not putting in the word I swyped ..but archy u could be right

 

[Chrisuk]

welcome to the real world of sparking. you ain't a spark till you've had a tingle or two.

Tingle..bloody tingle tel

 

[telectrix]

wtf is swyipe?

 

[telectrix]

is it switched --yipe?

 

[Andy78]

Are you perhaps typing with the arm that got the belt ? Lots of gibberish going on there. From what I gather though you were working on exposed live conductors. No sympathy from me there you absolute idiot !

If it was your choice as a trainee to work live then you deserve the shock, and a slap. If it was the guy who was supervising you who told you to work live, then you both deserve a slap.

There are times when it is appropriate to work live when circumstances prevent isolation. This does not sound like one of them.

 

[Chrisuk]

Put it this way I'm only half way through the ground floor..rest tomorrow..then first floor and I'll be babing it holding my first connector block tomorrow

 

[telectrix]

can tell you've not had a beer yet.

 

[Chrisuk]

Are you perhaps typing with the arm that got the belt ? Lots of gibberish going on there. From what I gather though you were working on exposed live conductors. No sympathy from me there you absolute idiot !

If it was your choice as a trainee to work live then you deserve the shock, and a slap. If it was the guy who was supervising you who told you to work live, then you both deserve a slap.

There are times when it is appropriate to work live when circumstances prevent isolation. This does not sound like one of them.

I was told holding the connector is safe...the store won't have power off

Am I supposed to refuse to work then when the main guy says hold the connector block....genuine question

 

[Andy78]

Put it this way I'm only half way through the ground floor..rest tomorrow..then first floor and I'll brr babing it holding my first connector block tomorrow

No need to be "babbing it", that's what safe isolation is for, to give you confidence you are working on a de-energised circuit.
Take this shock as a learning experience. If you don't learn from it then you probably deserve another shock. Get your AVI on anything you disconnect. Even if a circuit is isolated, you never know what you are getting hold of, especially above a suspended ceiling.

 

[Andy78]

I was told holding the connector is safe...the store won't have power off

Am I supposed to refuse to work then when then main guy says hold the connector block....genuine question

Yes ! unless you like putting your life on the line. Your Boss is breaking the EAWR and health and safety laws by asking you to work live when it is not necessary to do so.

 

[Silly Sausage]

Better get a pair of these on your way to work tomorrow morning!
Arco Website - Electricians Glove Class 0 1000V Cream 350mm from BM Polyco - Product 1457600

 

[Pete999]

Christ "DON'T WORK FREAKING LIVE MATE" bloody hell what's this trade coming to?

 

[Chrisuk]

No need to be "babbing it", that's what safe isolation is for, to give you confidence you are working on a de-energised circuit.
Take this shock as a learning experience. If you don't learn from it then you probably deserve another shock. Get your AVI on anything you disconnect. Even if a circuit is isolated, you never know what you are getting hold of, especially above a suspended ceiling.

That's fine..if I had it my way it would of been dead..but I was working on that one circuit all day today and they didn't want to be without light for that long
Certainly wasn't me that wanted to work live..of course I always kill every circuit I can before work..just today they didn't want lights off..gaffer said taking conductors out..kill circuit..but just putting a choc block on it can stay on

 

[7029 dave]

Take heed of Andy' comments.

 

[Chrisuk]

Christ "DON'T WORK FREAKING LIVE MATE" bloody hell what's this trade coming to?

Yes ! unless you like putting your life on the line. Your Boss is breaking the EAWR and health and safety laws by asking you to work live when it is not necessary to do so.

See this Is why I came in here..now I have other ppls opinions on it..thanks

 

[Pete999]

If your boss made you work live then he's the biggest muppet of all time, should be given a stiff talking to behind the shed:rant:

 

[Pete999]

google safe isolation procedures, print it out and pin on your boss's forehead, ohh and read it yourself before you go to work tomoz:nuke:

 

[trev]

Am I supposed to refuse to work then when the main guy says hold the connector block....genuine question

Yes! When there is a means of isolation then it should be used unless there are incredibly good reason not to. The store owner not wanting the place dark is not a good reason.
How would he/she/the company have reacted if you had been blown off whatever you were standing on and injured yourself or been killed? With the HSE crawling all over them and your employer that excuse would not wash.
Get your gaffer to rig some temporary lighting so that you get to go home at the end of the day, not to a hospital or mortuary. You're a trainee, you probably don't want to question your employer or rock the boat by going against what those above you in the food chain say but for your own sake mate tell this clown that what he's asking you to do is dangerous

 

[Chrisuk]

google safe isolation procedures, print it out and pin on your boss's forehead, ohh and read it yourself before you go to work tomoz:nuke:

You are making it like I went into work today and thought fuk it I'll work live

That site didn't want the lights out

Boss said if taking conductors out .kill it

But just putting a connector block in a choc block is fine

My years experience .over his 12 or so...I usually listen to him

 

[Chrisuk]

Yes! When there is a means of isolation then it should be used unless there are incredibly good reason not to. The store owner not wanting the place dark is not a good reason.
How would he/she/the company have reacted if you had been blown off whatever you were standing on and injured yourself or been killed? With the HSE crawling all over them and your employer that excuse would not wash.
Get your gaffer to rig some temporary lighting so that you get to go home at the end of the day, not to a hospital or mortuary. You're a trainee, you probably don't want to question your employer or rock the boat by going against what those above you in the food chain say but for your own sake mate tell this clown that what he's asking you to do is dangerous

Thank you very much trev..I don't want to lose this job or opportunity and I do believe stuff he says...why would I question him when I have so much less experience

I only wanted help and advice..not a roasting......I got that earlier

 

[Pete999]

He is just cutting corners to make more money, I have about 40 years experience matey and I wouldn't tell any trainee/apprentice to work live, just suppose you were killed? I bet he wouldn't "I told to make sure he isolated the supply" now would he? but he would be deep in the brown stuff if you were injured in any way, yes most Sparks get a belt, usually through stupidity, take it from me you have been lucky, check out the google thing I sent you and have a butchers at some of the electrical accidents on youtube,

 

[trev]

Thank you very much trev..I don't want to lose this job or opportunity and I do believe stuff he says...why would I question him when I have so much less experience

I only wanted help and advice..not a roasting......I got that earlier

Any roasting you get here will be done from concern mate. I don't think anyone is having a go at you as such.
As far as I'm concerned you've been asked to do something which a trainee at your level should never ever be asked to do.
I've got a first year apprentice with me at the moment and I wouldn't dream of asking him to work live.

 

[Pete999]

Thank you very much trev..I don't want to lose this job or opportunity and I do believe stuff he says...why would I question him when I have so much less experience

I only wanted help and advice..not a roasting......I got that earlier

He's a clown not you Trev the muppet telling the OP to hold the connector it's OK, Jesus

 

[R G]

One of the most dangerous places to get a belt is on steps or ladder , also you say an RCD was in place , well if it did operate you were lucky , if you got a belt between L & N and you're on insulated steps , the RCD would probably have never operated , the message is clear son ,DONT work live and test first before you start work ..

 

[trev]

If you don't want to rock the boat the HSE have a 24 hour line you can ring and you can talk to someone about your concerns, if they think they're valid then they'll visit the site and if necessary someone will get their arse handed to them on a silver plate.
I did it about 10 years ago when there was asbestos being stripped on a site I was working on, I thought it was a bit dodgy so rang them, they "happened to be passing" the following day and "noticed the stripping" going on and "decided to inspect the methods, risk assessments etc.

 

[davesparks]

I think we have established that you and your supervisor were in the wrong to be working on a live circuit.

If the owner of the shop does not want the lights off for you to work then the sensible solution is to arrange to do the job outside of trading hours, a couple of overnighters is a lot better than putting your life on the line!

Now the question is what are you going to do next? Your life has been placed at risk by your employer, you need to put this in the companies accident book and report this dangerous incident to the HSE.

 

[trev]

He's a clown not you Trev the muppet telling the OP to hold the connector it's OK, Jesus

I never said he was a clown mate, I meant his gaffer was

 

[Chrisuk]

One of the most dangerous places to get a belt is on steps or ladder , also you say an RCD was in place , well if it did operate you were lucky , if you got a belt between L & N and you're on insulated steps , the RCD would probably have never operated , the message is clear son ,DONT work live and test first before you start work ..

Don't know what it was between but yes the rcd kicked in and I was up ladders...I'll refuse it tomorrow if I have too
I'd rather miss out on the rest of the job than be Brown bread

 

[Kamikaze]

Thank you very much trev..I don't want to lose this job or opportunity and I do believe stuff he says...why would I question him when I have so much less experience

I only wanted help and advice..not a roasting......I got that earlier

I hope you put that little tingle in the accident book. Next time your in doubt about health and safety just ask your boss to see the risk assessment, method statement and permit to work. At the very least it will make him sweat a bit.:biggrin:

 

[SPARTYKUS]

I've had three p!$$3r5 (sorry mods but wanted to use the correct term....) in my time.

all three were working alone, and I was RUSHING.

silly man, but still here to learn (maybe? 4th time might get me) from it.

 

[Slowhand]

Have a look in BGB Part 2 Definitions.

Instructed Person. A person ADEQUATELY ADVISED OR SUPERVISED BY SKILLED PERSONS to enable him or her TO AVOID THE DANGERS WHICH ELECTRICITY MAY CREATE.

I'm not saying you should know this yet mate but the muppet you work for should!!

 

[davesparks]

Sod the BGB, it's the EAWR which is actually law and is relevant here.

 

[Chrisuk]

Don't have the BGB.. first year so was Told I don't need it yet. And again I listened to someone because if I don't how do I learn...I've got to believe what a time served spark says..why would I not...they should know best...if all else fails I come on here and get my --- handed to me haha jk

 

[Slowhand]

Sod the BGB, it's the EAWR which is actually law and is relevant here.

Yes l agree with you entirely but my point is that his boss should be teaching safe working practices and the OP should be advised and supervised not just told to get on with it.

I thought he might need to know that.

 

[shanky887614]

working live is fine as long as you take certain precautions, first only use vde screwdrivers, hold things with vde pliers/long nose pliers.

yes it will take longer but its safer.

never put hands on chockblock etc with live cables, the cables can fall out sometimes if they didnt bite properly

 

[Chrisuk]

Got 2 sets of vde hand tools and I'll hold my hand up..I had vde long noise pliers in my pocket when it happened...but I was told touching the plastic Is safe..like a plonker I believed it..like I said I'd been working since 8am and must of put 15 connectors in blocks using my hands only touching the plastic

But I'm not thick..message received ppl

 

[7029 dave]

working live is fine as long as you take certain precautions, first only use vde screwdrivers, hold things with vde pliers/long nose pliers.

yes it will take longer but its safer.

never put hands on chockblock etc with live cables, the cables can fall out sometimes if they didnt bite properly

Don't forget the rubbers, if you must.!! lol

 

[Lucien Nunes]

Don't have the BGB.. first year so was Told I don't need it yet.

You don't need one of the principal sources of reference for your trade? Why ever not? I got my first copy of the regs when I was 8.

I won't give you any agro about the live working thing, it's been covered already! But then, think ahead... even if you've been told that touching the plastic is 'safe' (it's not, it's only single insulation) why would you not expect to find a loose cable that popped out and touched you, or cause an arc that burned or blinded you? Nothing's infallible, especially other sparks' work!

PS the plastic housing is called a Choc Box, not chock blocks, That's slang for terminal block itself.

 

[davesparks]

working live is fine as long as you take certain precautions, first only use vde screwdrivers, hold things with vde pliers/long nose pliers.

yes it will take longer but its

There's a lot more to it than just using insulated tools!

First and foremost is that it is a last resort if there is no other option.

Inconvenience, not wanting to work late, the boss putting pressure on you, you can't be bothered to walk all the way to the DB and back or anything like that are not good reasons!

 

[davesparks]

Don't have the BGB.. first year so was Told I don't need it yet. And again I listened to someone because if I don't how do I learn...I've got to believe what a time served spark says..why would I not...they should know best...if all else fails I come on here and get my --- handed to me haha jk

Yes you have to listen to your mentor, but you have to use your own brain too. You are not a sheep, you don't have to blindly and unthinkingly follow your leader!

 

[SPARTYKUS]

There's a lot more to it than just using insulated tools!

First and foremost is that it is a last resort if there is no other option.

Inconvenience, not wanting to work late, the boss putting pressure on you, you can't be bothered to walk all the way to the DB and back or anything like that are not good reasons!

Or rushing because its beer o'clock:nono:

 

[Sparkie30]

Got 2 sets of vde hand tools and I'll hold my hand up..I had vde long noise pliers in my pocket when it happened...but I was told touching the plastic Is safe..like a plonker I believed it..like I said I'd been working since 8am and must of put 15 connectors in blocks using my hands only touching the plastic

But I'm not thick..message received ppl

just take it as lesson and try not to do it again. it happened to most sparks i know, me aswell.

 

[R G]

I would ensure the guy your working with carries out a proper risk assessment before starting work, this would have to be done before any live working is even considered. this would also lead into the safe isolation as well ,and be for your own personal safety ,,,

 

[Pete999]

working live is fine as long as you take certain precautions, first only use vde screwdrivers, hold things with vde pliers/long nose pliers.

yes it will take longer but its safer.

never put hands on chockblock etc with live cables, the cables can fall out sometimes if they didnt bite properly

The certain precaution would be???? switching off, locking off and testing with an approved voltage indicator as per the ESC guidance wouldn't it. VDE screwdrivers my backside, this is a young Lad starting out on his chosen career and your saying it's OK to work live, get real Shanky

 

[shanky887614]

The certain precaution would be???? switching off, locking off and testing with an approved voltage indicator as per the ESC guidance wouldn't it. VDE screwdrivers my backside, this is a young Lad starting out on his chosen career and your saying it's OK to work live, get real Shanky

real? there are times when you cannot turn the power off, it is best practise to not touch copper unless you know its not connected to anything.

if you are working in a control panel you cant just turn them off because it can cause very bad consequences.
we work in hospitals/ metal wards etc and there not places that can be done out of hours

 

[GMES]

Chris I took to you the 1st time you posted and we have spoken away from the main forum in the past, so It winds me up that you are falling for what this ar$ehole is asking you to do, he knows it is wrong, but more importantly you know it is wrong!!
I know it is hard to stand up to someone who is giving you a chance, but that does not give him the right to put your life at risk!!
Let me know where your working and i will happily pop down and attach said conductors to his Nut's and see how long he can stay on the ladder. You know you can get in touch away from here if you need any advice.
Let this be a lesson now shut up moaning and get the Beer's in.