Twin&earth and SWA installed loose on floor

[Spoon]

Does no one have safety concerns for the spider in the pic?

 

[freddo]

The armoured cable looks small, I'm going to say it is split concentric - size unknown...

 

[Toneyz]

I thought concentric cable was only allowed to be used by the DNO. Is it allowed under BS7671 if so which table?

 

[Deleted member 26818]

Hum ..... let me quote from BYB p416

"If you are the person ordering the work, but not the owner of the installation, you should pass the certificate , or a full copy of it including the schedules, immediately to the owner"

17th Edition 632.1, AMD1, AMD2 & AMD3 Following the initial verification required by Chapter 61, an Electrical Installation Certificate, togetherwith schedules of inspection and schedules of test results, shall be given to the person ordering the work. These schedules shall be based on the models given in Appendix 6.

18th Edition 644.1 Except where Regulation 644.4.201 applies, upon completion of the verification of a new installation or an addition or alteration to an existing installation, including the replacement of a distribution board or consumer unit, an Electrical Installation Certificate based on the model given in Appendix 6 shall be issued to the person ordering the work.

 

[Octopus]

^^ did you not check the page in the BYB .....

 

[Deleted member 26818]

^^ did you not check the page in the BYB .....

Reg No?

 

[StigOfTheDump]

So... my brother cannot see the spec of the SWA embossed on it anywhere, but has just measured the OD of it: actually only 12mm.
By my reading of the datasheets, that makes it 1.5sqmm x 2 or 3 core.
So the CCC of SWA is much higher than that for the equivalent T&E (or tri-rated cable that I'm familiar with), but 1.5 still tops out at 27 or 29A, and I'd like to bet that the MCB is 32A rated...

 

[StigOfTheDump]

Also, we can now confirm that there is an SWA gland into the CU, but no gland into the isolator - which is fitted in an inaccessible void behind a kitchen cabinet, so is no use as an isolator i.e. just functions as a terminal box...

 

[Pete999]

Think you are all forgetting who installed this cable, my take 2 core with a clip on the armour at each end for the cpc

 

[Midwest]

So... my brother cannot see the spec of the SWA embossed on it anywhere, but has just measured the OD of it: actually only 12mm.
By my reading of the datasheets, that makes it 1.5sqmm x 2 or 3 core.
So the CCC of SWA is much higher than that for the equivalent T&E (or tri-rated cable that I'm familiar with), but 1.5 still tops out at 27 or 29A, and I'd like to bet that the MCB is 32A rated...

Also, we can now confirm that there is an SWA gland into the CU, but no gland into the isolator - which is fitted in an inaccessible void behind a kitchen cabinet, so is no use as an isolator i.e. just functions as a terminal box...

Measuring the diameter is a bit hit & miss, a competent sparks would be able to assess the conductor size. In your picture, the swa looks bigger then 12mm OD, comparing it to the tw&e cables?

The isolator in 'an inaccessible void behind a kitchen cabinet', could you explain more, how is your brother expected to isolate the cooker?

 

[Wilko]

Putting an isolator (and its screw connections) into an inaccessible void is not simply not ok. Oh Dear.

 

[telectrix]

Putting an isolator (and its screw connections) into an inaccessible void is not simply not ok. Oh Dear.

should be OK he can operate thew switch with a magnet

 

[StigOfTheDump]

The CU end of the SWA has been glanded - but with a stuffing gland:

Now I've received the pictures, I cannot identify what the 'allegedly SWA' cable really is - can anyone identify it from the image below?

 

[Wilko]

should be OK he can operate thew switch with a magnet

Or perhaps by telekinesis?

 

[Pete999]

To be honest that cable doesn't resemble SWA the picyures aren't that informative, however it looks a bodge job to me

 

[StigOfTheDump]

It doesn't look like SWA to me either. Can anyone identify it?

 

[Andy78]

It could be SWA, the white part being the bedding and I think there is a blurry bit of grey that could be armourings. Looks of a small size to get that bend in the bedding if it is SWA. And it is obviously not terminated properly if so

 

[telectrix]

looks like SWA as Andy says, with the bedding exposed, going to the isolator,and some stripped out inner from isolator to CCU. whatever it is, it's a complete abortion and needs ripping out.

 

[Pete999]

I think he will struggle for one of them, at best he might get a dubious minor works certificate....

Then if that' s all he gets, the kitchen company need to be taken to court for Malpractice.

 

[Octopus]

On the basis that the kitchen company will submit a final invoice just tell them to provide the electrical certificates with the invoice ...... Or it won't be paid

 

[StigOfTheDump]

Unfortunately, Magnet insist on 100% payment up-front, so there is no option for my brother to withhold payment pending a adequate resolution, certs etc.

 

[Pete999]

Unfortunately, Magnet insist on 100% payment up-front, so there is no option for my brother to withhold payment pending a adequate resolution, certs etc.

Yes like most of them

 

[solarsavings]

Might be 4 or 6mm xlpe.

 

[Octopus]

Unfortunately, Magnet insist on 100% payment up-front, so there is no option for my brother to withhold payment pending a adequate resolution, certs etc.

I would suggest he reminds magnet that he is expecting certificates on competition ....

 

[Pete999]

I would suggest he reminds magnet that he is expecting certificates on competition ....

Agree, keep on to the boogers, reckon you would have a better than evens chance of getting legal costs if you prosecuted them.

 

[Midwest]

It doesn't look like SWA to me either. Can anyone identify it?

Looks like NYY-J cable to me. A 3c 2.5 mm is 11.3mm, and 4mm is 13.1mm OD according to some links I've googled, with a 25A & 34A respectively.

 

[telectrix]

Looks like NYY-J cable to me. A 3c 2.5 mm is 11.3mm, and 4mm is 13.1mm OD according to some links I've googled, with a 25A & 34A respectively.

you need to get out more. .

 

[Midwest]

Its this heat. Has the Sun gone under the yardarm yet

 

[Midwest]

you need to get out more. .

PS I'm right though, ain't I

 

[StigOfTheDump]

Thank you Midwest. I agree, it looks like NYY-J cable, based on a quick google image search of that term. Must confess I'd never heard of the stuff, but that does explain the white inner jacket, no SWA glands, tight bend radii and small diameter.
So much for using armoured cable for the outdoor cable run then!

 

[DPG]

To be fair it probably doesn't need SWA, just something UV resistant.

 

[Midwest]

So much for using armoured cable for the outdoor cable run then!

NYY-J cable is designed to be used outdoors, in various circumstances.

 

[Midwest]

OP if your brothers not happy with the install. Put together a letter or an email of your concerns, and send it to the sales team, with whom you've made your purchase.

Ask them to address these matters. If that cable has a securing stuffing gland at one end, why hasn't it got one at the other, for example. The inner core should not be exposed.

 

[Toneyz]

It looks rushed in. you can easily wire PVC/PVC T & E through the voids and keep it neat. I think it could be 4.0mm 3 core SWA (I have had the jacket in SWA white) The SWA should be earthed at least one end SWA should be made off in some sort of compression gland.

 

[Wilko]

I'm used to cooker circuits in 6mm+, so let's hope it's not 2.5 ...

 

[Toneyz]

The CU end of the SWA has been glanded - but with a stuffing gland:

Now I've received the pictures, I cannot identify what the 'allegedly SWA' cable really is - can anyone identify it from the image below?

So the SWA is not earthed.

 

[Midwest]

So the SWA is not earthed.

What if it is NYY-J cable.

 

[Toneyz]

What if it is NYY-J cable.

Sorry Midwest never used or seen it as far as I know.

 

[StigOfTheDump]

We've now firmly established that the conductors are 2.5 sqmm. The spec is not embossed on the cable jacket where we'd expect to find it, but each of the 7 strands of copper in each of the 3 cores is around 0.7 mm in diameter, so πr² X 7 gives us 2.5 sqmm

 

[Midwest]

We've now firmly established that the conductors are 2.5 sqmm. The spec is not embossed on the cable jacket where we'd expect to find it, but each of the 7 strands of copper in each of the 3 cores is around 0.7 mm in diameter, so πr² X 7 gives us 2.5 sqmm

Only person that actually clarify what spec this cable is, is the installer.

 

[Midwest]

The spec is not embossed on the cable jacket where we'd expect to find it

Here's another thread with an NYY-J cable, with pictures of identification etc;

3Ph sub-mains supplied via 5-core NYY, not SWA. OK or not? - https://www.electriciansforums.co.uk/threads/3ph-sub-mains-supplied-via-5-core-nyy-not-swa-ok-or-not.167503/page-2#post-1437585

 

[Pete999]

The job hasn't been signed off or certified yet. Anyway, I'm advising that my brother shouldn't accept this work.
The contractor was going to do the external run in T&E until my brother (a civil engineer by profession) insisted that SWA be used.

Just been looking at this thread again, and have to ask why would your Brother stipulate SWA?

 

[Pete999]

The job hasn't been signed off or certified yet. Anyway, I'm advising that my brother shouldn't accept this work.
The contractor was going to do the external run in T&E until my brother (a civil engineer by profession) insisted that SWA be used.

Just been looking at this thread again, and have to ask why would your Brother stipulate SWA?

 

[Toneyz]

Just been looking at this thread again, and have to ask why would your Brother stipulate SWA?

Civil Engineer=groundworker they are used to installing SWA for the electrical contractor so I suppose he knows it by default as outdoor cable.

 

[Pete999]

Civil Engineer=groundworker they are used to installing SWA for the electrical contractor so I suppose he knows it by default as outdoor cable.

 

[Pete999]

Should keep is nose out then.

 

[telectrix]

looks like SWA as Andy says, with the bedding exposed, going to the isolator,and some stripped out inner from isolator to CCU. whatever it is, it's a complete abortion and needs ripping out.

and i got a "bad spelling" for that by a member who's posted less than 30 times in 8 years. hmmm.

 

[Deleted member 26818]

Well you did use a comma before the word ‘and’.
Also there’s supposed to be a space between the comma and ‘and’.

 

[w0z]

been called some names in the past, but never Teletext. finger hovering over the "dumb" button.

Consider it a badge of honour. They should bring back Teletext.

 

[Colin33]

Cable Specification: NYY-J Mains and Control Cable Non Armoured manufactured to standard IEC60502-1 and VDE 0276-603 and available in sizes 5mm to 16mm and in 2, 3, 4, 5 and 7 cores. The cable features solid plain copper conductors, PVC insulated, PVC filler, PVC outer sheath. Black. 600/1000 volts grade to IEC60502-1 and VDE 0276-603. For installation indoors and outdoors as underground, or in cable ducts, installations with additional protection where mechanical damage is unexpected.

Am I reading this right?