Terminating SWA with Wylex REC Supply Isolators

[Michaelwgroves]

Its all very well doing research but you've said your sparky (if he exists) is on holiday. Leave it to the sparky to quote you for a price and then if you're not happy get a couple more in to quote.

If you are not happy with the imput from the members here maybe you should try other forums.

No, just you, you seem to be on a mission, not sure what your objective is but you seem to be alone.
You are free to post your opinion but you just don't stop.

 

[High Tower]

No, just you, you seem to be on a mission, not sure what your objective is but you seem to be alone.
You are free to post your opinion but you just don't stop.

Ok I think we have established that this is not a DIY job and that you are and rightly so going to get professionals to install it. this is part of what the forum is here for to advise people to make the correct choices. We are not here to instruct people how to do the job themselves.

 

[Michaelwgroves]

I dont remember meters being mentioned, How are you intending on doing this?, it opens a whole can of worms now. are you having your own meters installed and charging your tenants yourself or are you intending on having prepay meters, if its pre pay then the DNN must install them and their own Ryefield to supply them, and that will be big cost!.

If you are having meters in the switch room then you are back to Ryefield - meter - switch fuse - galv - swa and with all of that you will need a switch room the size of a bedsit for all of that 12 x over

if you are having the meters in the bedsits then the hager solution will work. you can get cu's to go in the bedsits that have meters built into them, so it would be
Cutout - hager - swa - cu with integral meter.

This thread has moved around at bit, sorry I should have probably gave full details at the begining. Your paragraph 2 is what I'm looking to do.
I'll reasearch Ryefield tomorrow, maybe i'll give them a call. I'll post again tomorrow with an update.
i want to keep all meters together to aid management as I am working with a charity and they will be handling this. Trying to get into every flat would be a nightmare for them.

 

[Michaelwgroves]

Ok I think we have established that this is not a DIY job and that you are and rightly so going to get professionals to install it. this is part of what the forum is here for to advise people to make the correct choices. We are not here to instruct people how to do the job themselves.

Thank you, exactly what's happening, just to add building control are also involved.

Now back to the job in hand.

 

[Octopus]

Thank you, exactly what's happening, just to add building control are also involved.

Now back to the job in hand.

Time to employ a proper sparky. lol couldn't resist.

 

[Guest55]

No, T&E submains in flats isnt a good idea, because you then have the issue of discrimination between the sub RCD and the RCD's in the CU.

youre assuming the t&e subs will be buried in the wall to require rcd protection , but with 12 in total its fairly likely they'll be surface fixed.

anyways , back to the OP .....
if i was using the services of a qualified spark i'd be sitting down with him to hear the options he recommends , so why go into the details of the job on a forum ?
why do we need to walk you through the job if you've got a guy on site ?

 

[High Tower]

This thread has moved around at bit, sorry I should have probably gave full details at the begining. Your paragraph 2 is what I'm looking to do.
I'll reasearch Ryefield tomorrow, maybe i'll give them a call. I'll post again tomorrow with an update.
i want to keep all meters together to aid management as I am working with a charity and they will be handling this. Trying to get into every flat would be a nightmare for them.

Ok to do this then you are going to need a 12 way Ryefield http://www.lucyswitchgear.com/media/2396/cut-out-brochure.pdf (page 12)

12 x credit meters something like Electric Meter | Electricity Meters Ex Works from CL Refurbishments

about 100m of each 25mm tail

and 12 switch fuses http://www.electrium.co.uk/Wylex2007.pdf (page 33) NHSW3100

 

[High Tower]

youre assuming the t&e subs will be buried in the wall to require rcd protection , but with 12 in total its fairly likely they'll be surface fixed.

anyways , back to the OP .....
if i was using the services of a qualified spark i'd be sitting down with him to hear the options he recommends , so why go into the details of the job on a forum ?
why do we need to walk you through the job if you've got a guy on site ?

Quite possibly but i think the chances are that it would have to pass through walls floors and ceilings at some point.

 

[Guest55]

Quite possibly but i think the chances are that it would have to pass through walls floors and ceilings at some point.

still doesnt req rcd protection to pass through a wall or routes in a floor void , only if buried in a wall.

 

[High Tower]

still doesnt req rcd protection to pass through a wall or routes in a floor void , only if buried in a wall.

Im not sating your wrong mate but i dont think i would feel to comfy running 12 T&E subs through a building with no RCD protection, i just think a SWA is a better idea. but as i said before that is only my opinion and preference.

 

[Guest55]

fair do's HT , just keeping the mods on their feet. ;-)

i notice silence on my earlier question.........

 

[High Tower]

which one mate?

 

[Octopus]

Im not sating your wrong mate but i dont think i would feel to comfy running 12 T&E subs through a building with no RCD protection, i just think a SWA is a better idea. but as i said before that is only my opinion and preference.

Only competent sparkies reviewing the site/build would be in a position to define the appropriate solution!

 

[Guest55]

which one mate?

which mod or which earlier question ?
lol.
my questions on the OP's spark involved in his job.

 

[High Tower]

I dont think there is anything wrong with the OP exploring all possibilities and at the moment he has not asked us to explain how you would go about carrying out such a install and has only discussed the different methods. which i think if you are going to spend that kind of money there is nothing wrong with familiarizing yourself with all of the possible options.

I dont think any of us has divulged enough information for anyone to try and attempt the install

 

[Octopus]

I dont think there is anything wrong with the OP exploring all possibilities and at the moment he has not asked us to explain how you would go about carrying out such a install and has only discussed the different methods. which i think if you are going to spend that kind of money there is nothing wrong with familiarizing yourself with all of the possible options.

I dont think any of us has divulged enough information for anyone to try and attempt the install

Don't you believe it!

AND if you read the OP again you DO get the impression he is the sparky too.

 

[Engineer54]

Originally Posted by Engineer54
I would expect there to be a means of local isolation before the Ryefield panel!! You could even use a suitably sized/rated 3 phase (if this is a 3 phase installation) Fuse DB, with a main isolator. Any thing is better than the proposals put forward so far, for separate this and that's!! lol!!

Only problem with that is that it means the isolator would isolate all 12 flats which isn't exactly ideal

Exactly the same as with a Ryefield panel, with a main isolator or switch fuse supplying that panel!! The DB fuses will be the main protection for the flat supplies and also a means of isolation should the need arise!! No requirement for there to be any means of main isolation within the DB, the tails can be directly connected to the DB phase and neutral bars...

Think i understand what you mean now, your talking about an interlocking isolator switch, where the door can't be opened without the isolator being in the off position!! ...lol!! ​

 

[Michaelwgroves]

Don't you believe it!

AND if you read the OP again you DO get the impression he is the sparky too.

I thought we had put this to bed, but so we hopefully can let me give you some more information;


Some of the work requires planning permission (additional flat), so building control involved.
Upgrading mains requires UK Power Networks.
Additional Meters requires EDF
HMO licence involves council
Charity as tenant means dot all the i's and cross all the t's.

I really can't see how anyone other than a qualified electrician could take on a project this size for starters, but if a DIY'er did, do you reckon he could get passed all the departments above?
Surly it's just not possible; and if it is, I don't need to know how.............

Okay, about me; I want to know everything, even if I don't need to know, I want to know. Imagine your worst customer, that's me.
Everyone that works with me knows what I'm like, they talk to me straight. When I meet a tradesman for the first time, I tell them what I'm like. One builder friend refuses to work for me because I'm too annul.
I don't cut corners, but if I can get the same job done cheaper I will. I can be hard to work for, but I make my requirements very clear at the outset, if your work is not up to it, don't take the work on.

Another reason is co's there are a lot of sharks out there, true storey...... In the office the boiler broke down 3 weeks ago. Girl in the office called plumber, he said needs new boiler £2,600. She called next plumber, he said yep new boiler £2,800. Need to move boiler as you can't have electrics (fused spur) under boiler!
I then got involved, asked plumber to meet me on site. I got thier early, checked error code and phoned manufacturer, they said part A or Part B, both in stock, several pounds each. Plumber turns up, I asked why he can't fix, he said you can't get parts as the manufacturer no longer exists. Imagine the look on his face when I told him I just got off the phone and this is how you fix it, it was a picture. That afternoon I booked a call with British Gas who fixed it on one of thier fixed price deals.
This is why I want to know, co's only then can I truely be confident I am getting the best soloution at the best price, simples!

My sparky is excellant, but that does not mean he has a monopoly on idea's, only when you air your idea's to many can you truly be assured of the best idea.

I hope we can now move on.

 

[Michaelwgroves]

Okay back to basics, here's an image of how I think it should look. I'm only showing 6 units, but it will be 12.
I want to keep all the meters together in the intake cupboard for easy reading. EDF will bill tenants directly.
I want the ability to isolate each flat independantly at this point.
It is highly likley the cable to the CU's will pass through walls, it appears best to use SWA just in case. It also looks likly the load will go over 60A, so SWA makes sense here and future proofs the project.

I'm off to research Ryefield panel, I assume this is still best option at the moment?

 

[jaydee81]

best option in my opinion is 12 metal clad switch fuses control gear direct do good one for about £50 and 16mm 3 core swa